If you came to this page you are probably looking for a go kart engine or a predator 212cc engine, you are in luck. I have been upgrading and building go karts for years and have some engine buying advice for the racer, or novice yard kart driver. Lets have a look at the options for performance mods & stock engines:
Go Kart Engines
Most go kart engines fall into the category of race karts, or fun / yard karts. That lines have blurred with the advent of cheap Chinese predator 212cc go kart engines.
Go kart engines can be used for racing or just putting around the yard depending on what performance parts (or mods) that you upgrade.
There are many small industrial 4 stroke engines you can use, but who cares about them. Lets skip all those, and just go straight to the cheapest, and very reliable go kart engine: the predator 212cc 6.5 hp engine.
Predator Engines
Predator engines have destroyed the competition. Because they are so inexpensive, predator engines have opened a whole new world to go karters. They are cheap, and can easily be modified for added performance.
Predator engines literally bolt right on to virtually all standard go karts ever made. The bolt mounting pattern is universal.
If you have an old go kart you need to restore, you can simply buy a predator 212cc engine (amazon link) and breath new life into an old go kart. This engine is a performer right out of the box, and should get your go kart running anywhere from 20 mph all the way up to 35mph in its stock form. But we cant leave well enough alone can we? Let’s get to the modifications.
Predator 212cc Engine Performance Parts
Predator 212cc engines can have their stock parts removed, and replaced with performance parts (parts that increase horsepower and speed compared to the stock predator 6.5 hp engine). Here is a quick overview of what I recommend doing first.
Engines need three things: air, fuel and spark. When you add more air and fuel into an engine, you get more torque and horsepower, which is the cheapest bang for your buck.
Intake The stock air filter and intake keeps the engine from ‘breathing in’ too much air. The less restriction you have for the engine’s air intake, the more air and fuel will enter the combustion chamber. A predator 212cc high flow intake adapter and high flow air filter literally bolt on to the existing carburetor and require no more than a wrench and screwdriver to install. This will give you extra power when you step on the gas.
Exhaust The stock predator muffler keeps the engine from ‘breathing out’ too much air. If you have lots of air coming into the engine, you need to release it with little resistance for added performance. That’s when the predator 212cc performance high flow exhaust header really comes into play. You are now able to shove air and fuel quickly into the engine, and release it with little resistance, adding some serious horsepower and torque that you can FEEL when you step on the gas.
Re-Jet With all the air you are putting into the engine, you may also need to drill out the jet a little bigger. Making the hole in the jet larger will allow more fuel to enter the combustion chamber, preventing a ‘lean’ condition that overheats and destroys engines when they have the governor removed. If you have the intake and exhaust complete, go ahead and drill out the jet. Most people use between a #36 and #38 jet in conjunction with the predator 212cc performance parts. If this is something you are not comfortable doing, you can always search for a jet and install one like I did in this short video below.
Remove Governor The governor does what it is named after. It governs the rotations per minute (RPMs) of the go kart engine. Removal is kind of difficult as you will need to open up the crankcase cover, remove the governor, plug the hole you created, and hook up a direct throttle afterwards. Sound complicated? Heres a video. If you are not comfortable doing this, you can REALLY mess up an engine by improperly removing the governor, dropping lifters, or bending valves because you didn’t know what the heck the engine timing was all about and didn’t line up the camshaft dots. Does any of this not make sense to you? If so, scroll below the video for the answer.
Not mechanically inclined? Small engines are perfect to learn on as they are very simple. You can find a standard predator212cc engine online, then work your way up with mods by replacing the intake, exhaust, jet, and disconnecting the governor. It is up to you what you would like to do, and I have added just enough information here for you to get into the go kart engine scene. Good luck and have fun zooming around in your modded predator 212cc performance go kart engine!
Hi, I am looking to buy a kit what is the difference between live axle and fixed?
I’m looking to build a bike frame using a method known as Bent Lamination from veneered wood stock layered up + a master mold I design for my lamination to adopt the form of. I want my bike to have power but the frame to be made out of 80% organic materials. I watched your video. Are there other exhaust options I can choose from? And how do I make my bike road legal with a plate, emissions, insurance, etc? I’d like it to be an alternative commuter to my work van.
I have A 196cc Baja mini bike will a torque converter make it faster. Thanks.
yes
I got a 212 with 22 pound valve springs mikuni carb and torque with 50 sprocket what will my top speed be and rpms thank u
Why do people call me crazy when I tell them that I took a Honda gx140 head and put on a predator 212 motor and I got like 10 horsepower compression ratio.?
No for the reason being is that you are not increasing your rpm. You are just changing the torque ratio. You are going to have an easier time going up hills and acceltering but your top speed will not change.
No,a torque converter will not make it faster ..it will make it easier if you do lots of starts and stops,and will make the bike quicker out of the hole.but you will definitly loose some top end speed.
Just called new HF and they said they had 60363 hemi in stocks, brought 5 but they say 69730, die cast head, flame arrestor muffler, circular air cleaner, marked G210FA on the front of the motor, by all rights a hemi but different part #.
Bonjour, je me suis acheter un moteur Briggs XR950 Professional de 208 cc. J’ai acheter le kit stage 1 chez Go power sport.com et j’ai aussi commander les ressorts de valves 18 lb. Ma question, c’est quoi l’espacement que je dois laisser ? Je vais devoir réajuster mes valves…. J’ai vu plusieurs réponse possible.
0.003 ? 0.005 ? 0.007 ?
Merci beaucoup, j’attends de vos nouvelles 🙂
I put a stage one filter on my 212 predator engine now it bogs down when you give it all the throttle
jetting is wrong
Is there any way to run my predator 212cc motor without a clutch or does it have to have it
The engine itslef doesnt need a clutch to run but if you were to say put the engine on a go kart or minibike, you wouldnt be able to idle without a clutch. so if you put a sprocket in place of a centrifugal clutch you would have to push start your bike/kart everytime, and it would be very impractical. So yes and no.
No its not the jetting your intake adaptor is wrong missing the vacuum vent cut out
No and not sure why you think that..
Use screws on the side for tuning of Carb. Or change jets in Carb. Google it.
That could be a couple of reasons when a part is interchanged so is the response when adding that u increased the air in take but the exhaust is still restricted that could have some play but you should put a race carb on an ret jet it to #36-#38
WHenever you do a mod that increases air flow you need more fuel and vice versa. WHen tinkering with any kind of performance mods I like to weld a threaded bung in the exhaust for an automotive type O2 sensor. With a cheap air/fuel gauge it will tell you exactly how your mod affected engine efficiency. It takes all the guess work out of engine mods. WHen you have everything the way you want i, take the O2 sensor out and put int a threaded plug
Gas / air /and spark. Do all 3 .
il s’agit d’un site prédateur 212. essayez de trouver un forum briggs. Bonne chance
How can I order a stage 1 kit for a Predator 212cc motor
link is above
If I get the stage 1 mod for a predator 212 can I still leave the govner attached? And if I do will it basically counter act the stage 1 upgrade
Yes you can leave it in. Predator stage 1 mods will still give you GAINZZZZZZ even with the governor intact.
I recently built 3 new go karts and bought 3 new briggs cr950 engines to put on them. All 3 engines cut out while going around corners or over bumps.. tge carbs have no high end adjustment only idle adjustment any ideas on how to fix the problem?
fuel pump or low oil cut off
What I did on my 212 predator clone was unplug the oil sensor because the oil would always go to one side and would just cut off around corners but if you do this then you have to check your oil frequently otherwise you might run out of oil and seize the engine meaning it can’t run.
remove the low oil sensor
Did you take out the low oil sensor? Or Atleast cut the sensor wire? If you didn’t than I guarantee that’s your problem if not, than you need to adjust the float in your carb and make sure the carb is level as much as possible
Unplug the oil sensor. We had the same problem with out new 212 engine. Sensor can be completely removed from inside crankcase. This allowed more oil to be added. Just keep tabs on oil level and change it often.
How much gain
Does anyone know exactly how much extra power you get when you remove the governor and install the stage 1 kit. Like RPMs and speed
20% gains in torque, and ability to rev to valve float. 52% gain in speed.
Hi, I’m new to predator engines and I don’t know much, but if I add an exhaust, intake filter, a higher jet and remove the governor would it cause any damage to my non-hemi engine or greatly reduce the hours on it?
no it wont. The biggest risk you have when you remove the governor is valve float, which can cause damage over time, or drop the valve out of the retainer. 18 lb springs fix that. The next biggest risk is running at high rpms for sustained periods of time, which can cause the crank journal to seize to the connecting rod. This can be really bad, but isnt an issue for most people… until it is. The point here is that there is no clear answer, and the only way to be sure is to get your billet parts. Your mileage may vary.
Hello,
I have a Carter Gokart with a Honda GX160 motor on it, I installed a Predator OEM motor from HF. When moving the wet cluch over to the new engine it appears the shaft is longer on the predator, I looked up the specs for both motors and both say 2.43 length in shaft but my old Honda is only 2″ long and is not modified. Why do I have different lengths and where can I buy a motor with a 2″ shaft length that matches my Honda GX160 thanks.
Make sure u put in a billet rod and flywheel and will thank itself for doing that.
Hi, I just removed the governor and installed back all of the stock parts to how they were before and my engine will not start and it was working like new before. Only had about 1 mile on the engine before the governor delete.Any thoughts?
Retrace ur steps. Start from step one prior to breakdown of engine n removal of governor. Watch vids on YouTube or Google it. These are easy engines to repair. Research, dive in, U got it fam
Posted this in the general maintenance spot also not sure if that’s correct.
Hello, I’m new to the go cart world and bought a off road buggy. I was told it’s a gy6 with F/N/R that just needs a few parts, rather than fix it I’m thinking predator swap. I want electric start and F/N/R. Is this a option or do I need to fix it or replace with another Gy6? Thanks for any advice! Andy
there is a fnr gearbox specifically made for a 8 hp max engine. Start out with a honda gx200 electric start or a tillotson electric start. Predator 212 doesnt come in electric start.
While predator does not come with electronics start kits are available all over the internet and involve an obvious flywheel change addition of z charging stator and the the starter along with ignition circuitry.
These kits often sell for under 100 usd. And if you want lamps there is a 2 stage stator available for around 30 usd. Which puts out about 35 watts. You’ll also need a battery which are also available and affordable.
All in you should be able to do a starter charging and lighting system for right around 200 / 250 usd. if your handy and shop wisely.
Hope this helps.
You can buy a kit to make the predator 212 electric start..
can i make the same modifications with this same parts to my Honda GX200,does it effects anything or lead to any problem?
same mods are okay.
Think about putting performance parts on my 212cc predator engine for my Dingo by Manco go kart. Do that make any exhaust pipe that doesn’t look stupid or bent/shaped weird when its mounted on the engine?
thats subjective, all headers have some sort of a bend, otherwise they would stick out like a sore thumb. There are many shapes of exhaust headers for a predator 212.
does anyone know if u NEED a billet flywheel on a predator 212 with deleted governor? I really dont want to spend as much or more then the engine for it if I dont need to.it already has stage 1 performance kit installed ( stock valve springs)
you dont need one, but you do need one to prevent the magnet that is held onto the stock flywheel with a single screw and some glue from flying off, potentially causing your engine to break.
Change it the stock flywheel will blow apart like a bomb
yes and billet rod to be on safe side to handle the higher rpms. its best to hook up the internals then outside of engine mods
Here’s my two cents..
Stock flywheels are not designed to spin that fast. But some hold up for a while.
If the gov is the only mod your making your top end is still restricted by valve float and intake / feul / exhaust flow limitations.
Make ANY other mods and you strongly risk catching flying chunks of metal with your anatomy.
That sheet metal cover held on with a few screws isn’t stopping crap.
It’s only to keep morons from sticking their fingers in there.
Choose wisely.
Personally I feel keeping my body parts healthy and intact is worth more than the cost of a flywheel.
Why not just cut the linkage that connects the governor to the carb butterfly it operates. Then just find a way to prevent the butterfly mechanism that restricts air to slow the engine from operating at all?
This would be WAY easier than disassembling the whole engine!!!
From experience not removing it destroyed 2 of my engines. I have a Mikuni carb on mine and the governor engaged and sheared the piston on both engines its a mess.
Correct
Those parts would be left spinning with zero control inside your engine…. easier yes but there is a reason everyone else removes the parts. You can spend that extra 30 min removing the parts now or do it later when your rebuilding the engine because they come apart inside your block at 7k.
Just like the billet rod and higher rpm flywheel…. investments towards the future.
Does the cut off header make a different sound than the Trumpet header aswell?
Yes, trumpet is deafening, cut is loud AF.
Will a gx200 head fit on the 212 predator? Thank you
yes, and so will a gx160 head. The head dowels might not.
Hey kartfab I installed this stage 1 kit on my trailmaster cheetah and now it’s extremely hard to start. Cranks and cranks and eventually starts. This thing is a 2020 model absolutely 0 issues before installing the kit. Any ideas?
you arent using the choke
does anyone know if u NEED a billet flywheel on a predator 212 with deleted governor? I really dont want to spend as much or more then the engine for it if I dont need to.it already has stage 1 performance kit installed ( stock valve springs)
* sry about writing this as a reply, I couldn’t figure out how to comment
First off if you are going above 5000 rpm removing it then you will need new valve springs and a cam to match it then a billet flywheel because the other one will explode ad but don’t drop them because they get stress cracks. Also sometimes the piston will blow up in the engine to so be careful with that.
Does anyone know why my mini bike is bogging at half and full throttle after putting a Mikuni carb on like wth
jetting or needle height issue. likely needle height.
How do you correct needle height issue
yes
Do I need to change the centrifugal clutch that I have to accommodate for the stage 1 if so what clutch do I need
Is the trumpet header for the Predator 212cc much louder than a normal cut off end header?
At Harbor Freight the “Predator 6.5 HP (212cc) OHV Horizontal Shaft Gas Engine EPA/CARB” isn’t available for me and instead is being replaced by the “Predator 6.5 HP (212cc) OHV Horizontal Shaft Gas Engine EPA”.
It looks to have the same specs , but I am assuming no carburetor. Is that a problem or will it still work the same?
Same thing
CARB is the “California Air Resources Board;” the term CARB in the engine designation does not refer to carburetors. Non-CARB models are sold in states other than California, and did not go through the emissions certification process to be sold in California. Everything this article mentions pertains to either version of the engine.
Need Help:
I picked up a scooter frame,along with a 2019 Predator 212CC motor, which was not mounted to frame. I’ve had the motor for a few months, and it did have fuel in the tank when I first had it…and didn’t drain. Tonight I drained the fuel from carb, checked the jet to make sure it wasn’t plugged, cleaned the plug, checked for spark, and tried starting using both the choke, and then starting fluid. It’s getting spark, has compression, but after 15-25 pulls it won’t fire. I have not changed out the gas…but would that alone prevent it from starting at all, or running? Am I missing something? I’ve tried different settings on choke and throttle, and no dice. Maybe a clogged fuel filter? It was definitely getting gas when I was draining the excess from carb. WTF? This motor gets good reviews…so what next? The motor appears virtually like new STILL…
Welcome to the world of ethanol containing gasoline.
That’s why I went with the CR950 by Briggs & Stratton. Close to Predator performance but more resilient to ethanol. Assuming you don’t discriminate against any “non-Predator” questions posted: Is the governor removal on this thing pretty much the same as with the 212 engine?
governor mechanism on most small engines is about the same
try draining the gas, and possibly cleaning the carb ( take apart and clean.) if it needs a cleaning, there will be brown build up inside. u can clean it with carb cleaner from an auto shop and a toothbrush.
Check oil…they have a oil sensor in them that stops them from starting..look at kill switch to
I had my torque converter drive clutch on my 212 come apart on my leg sending parts flying everywhere I started researching a replacement and found it was cheaper to buy a 40 series with a 3/4″ to 1″ shaft and key kit than the 30. Went to install tonight and the key slots are different and the only way i see it working is if i cut the key in 2 to fit a slot in the back and the other in the front. my question is will cutting the key be unsafe for the torque of the motor?
Good luck. It should work if you machibe it right.
Hey KartFab* I’m not too big on the bucks how much does this engine cost? Can I use a high-speed lawnmower engine?
It cost about 150
The Predator 212 cc is on sale now at Harbor freight for $99. After making no changes to our 12 year old kart and pulling out of storage, the predator 212 cc started to blow white smoke from the exhaust, try to throttle with little rpm change. I’ll just go with a new engine at that price.
You can get one new in box at Harbor Freight for $199.99
nice because im making the cheapest cart.
will I need a torque converter if i put in predator 212? I have I think… a high rev 110 (gk110) in now, which is missing carb and exhaust and I cant find parts.
Thanks
Theyre on sale right now at harbor freight $95 before tax.
What issues will I run into if I tilt a predator 212 forward (carb side would end up being higher) about 15 degrees. The carb would no longer be level, same with gas tank. Would I have fuel delivery issues and, if so, how could I correct it? Would engine lubrication still function properly? Thanks for the help.
go kart racers do it all the time. not a big deal. just make sure it has about .5 qt (16 oz) of oil before you run it.
I run with my kart the same way. No problem just add more oil.
The Predator 212 cc is on sale now at Harbor freight for $99. After making no changes to our 12 year old kart and pulling out of storage, the predator 212 cc started to blow white smoke from the exhaust, try to throttle with little rpm change. I’ll just go with a new engine at that price.
Can u purchase this engine anywhere without the governor on it if yes where thanks
It comes with the governor in it. I guess you could buy from someone who took it out, but no. They always come with a governor.
Does upgrading the engine reduce the number of run hours/life in the engines?
yes but it depends on the upgrade
Tell me how you can remove the governor and still use the stock rocker arms, studs and push rods? That engine will bend a push rod or break a rocker arm after someone runs it wide open a few times. Im an OPEI certified Master Service Technition with over 35 years working in a lawnmower shop.
people do it all the time, you might want to check with any predator 212 go kart racing class to see just how far these engines are pushed with no failures…
I have a predator 212 stage 1 kit but everything else is stock valve springs rods fly wheel would removing my governor damage it?
no, just be safe about it. Dont cut corners to save $$, or you could seriously injure yourself, or worse, the engine. 🙂
I have a predator 212 stage 1 kit but everything else is stock valve springs rods fly wheel would removing my governor damage it?
i only run mine wide open, sometimes it shoots fire out when you let off, other than that it pops when the valves start floating and wont rev much past 5k rpms . cant break it if its not fixed
My buddies I race go karts with the predator and out of all of us only one has bent a push rod and zero rocker arm problems. We have upgraded intake, exhaust, jet, E-tube, springs, cam, .010 head gasket, flywheel and 32° timing
Not at all. If you rev it full throttle for a long period of time without the governor in the engine you may damage it but i haven’t run into problems yet.
I have a predator 212 hemi, ported head lapped valves, 265 cam, longer billet and flat top piston with valve reliefs cut, billet arc flywheel, holy moses carb running e85. The motor runs great but i can’t keep a 30 series torque converter together. Can you recommend a clutch for a #41 chain that will handle the 15-20hp that im making
Check into the noram clutches.
I have a212on predator generation and it smokes and uses about a pint of oil a day how do I fix it
Douglas
buy a new one.
If you have a 6.5 horse engine..then you install a stage 1 kit..roughly how many horses total do you think you have?
One living horse costs $1,500, and one 6.5 hp engine is capable of producing 6.5 horse power. Given the ratio of engine hp to horse cost, your answer expressed in living horse costs would be an increase of $1,500-$2,250 dollars.
i have a 212 as well and i just got it i put full tank of gas and oil and put the clutch on it didnt come with a screw in the shaft for the clutch the clutch came with little allen key screws i used them and put it on let is start it started first try and i went o go and it reved and made like a crash sound and it vibrated and i dont know what i did wrong please help
LOL, I just bought one last week. I’m not mechanically inclined for most of this so I’ve been doing random research. I used mower oil 10-30 and used Rec Fuel(NON ETHANOL)
I’ve heard that the machine need to be “broken in”. After I applied gas & oil I turned it over slowly with the kill switch on off. I then let it sit over night & ran it the next day for an hour on idle. I then changed the oil and switched to a Mobil one semi synthetic 10-30 which was ran for two hours only revving it slightly since it’s not on the bike and not under any load. I am going to change the oil a third time today and will put it on the bike stock; only after I ride it for 10-15 hours will I do the mods to the bike to make sure everything is working as it should and worn in right. Worst case scenario if I break it or do something wrong I got the 2 year warranty for $50 from Harbor Freight. But I know that it comes with 90 days warranty so if you’re within that time frame & think you did something wrong you can return it or you can pull a fast one and purchase a new motor and return the old on a week later ”no questions asked”…
You need a keyway to go into the shaft on the engine, the clutch should have one in it already. They are on Amazon for $17. And the set screws is just so it doesn’t slide off, you’ll need lock tight to keep them on.
I have a stock predator 212, it already has a weeny pipe on it. Where can I buy a kit with the top plate, throttle linkage, breather and adapter and what jets do I need? And how far advanced can I go with the timing? How much horse power does advancing the timing get?
just wondering if anyone put a predator with stage 3-4 kit in a Polaris 120 sled and does anyone sell them installed with the kits
I have mine on what used to be a 110cc chinese quad. It keeps destroying the torque converter. Ive burnt belts, over heated the springs. Its definately fun on such a little quad but also a death trap
Something your going to have to do on your own. I’m in progress on one now. The engine will fit just fine but you will have to play with things like intake and exhaust as the port angles are different. I picked up and exhaust that was fairly close and just torched it up to give it a slight bend. I changed over to a tillerson Mechanic fuel injector(Carb) to really dial in the fueling. Your going to play with carb and choke linkages but stick with it, its worth it.
I got a 212 pred from a guy, he said he did not know anything about it. I put it on my boys kart and tried to start it.. it seems like the valves are backwards. Like when pulling it in an attempt to start it it’s like the exhaust it trying to come out of air breather?? Any suggestions?
squirt some starter fluid in the carb opening and hold throttle open to try and start. Engine needs fuel, air, spark. Process of elimination. Most issues are from lack of maintenance (dirty carb).
Sounds like its out of time OR a rocker arm came off (under the valve cover). If he hasn’t oped the case and lied to you, Make sure the flywheel crank key hasn’t been sheared. Then pull the valve cover and check the rocker arms. Make sure they haven’t jumped off the little push rods. Re-check valve adjustment and see what you get.
It sounds like there is a bent intake valve.
make sure the fuel is on, the choke is closed and you have fuel of course, that is compression, the engine compresses air and ignites an air fuel mixture, if not,return it. my 212 did not start until in unplugged the oil level sensor, that is the yellow wire coming out of the block going to the small box bolted to the side of the block
Adjust your valves
Disclaimer: Spent my whole life working on race cars, zero years on small engines. My son, however, is wanting go start racing karts. His rookie division uses the Predator 212. I purchased a new one and broke it in. The only modification allowed is removal of the governor. I did this after break in and now it won’t hardly run. It will start with in the “run” position, but not the choke. After a minute or two, it dies. During that minute or two, if I give it a bit of throttle, it has little to no response and then gets close to dying. Do you recommend adjusting jets?
Thanks.
First off double check the timing dots and ensure that they are lined up. Make absolutely sure there is no air leak between carb and the head. These small engines won’t run for sh**I personally would get a much larger jet. See if it runs better. Don’t forget about stiffer valve springs to prevent valve float.
is govenor totally removed or just the arm ?
Hey Kartfab, 2 quick questions.
I have a 196cc Lifan that has a remover governor and basically a racing 22mm carb from Hua Li. It pulls, and ever since I put a torque converter(cheap one) it does non stop wheelies. I am going to be putting a 53 tooth split sprocket on the wheel, (it’s a DB30 Doodlebug) but my T.C. seems to engage later than I think it should. Any suggestions on how to lower the engagement RPM?
Secondly, I am going to be purchasing 22lb springs, a .265 Cam, and a Billet flywheel, so almost a complete stage 2, except the rod. Does the rod add any extra benefit? Besides weight, do I need to spend the extra $60-$100 for a shiny job? Or does it have any actual benefit to the motor. Can’t find any actual reasoning anywhere that talks about Rod benefits.
Thanks!
the stock connecting rod does not oil the crank journal at high rpms. If you spin the engine to high rpms the crank journal will dry out and heat up and cause the rod to seize onto the crank and snap. The stock connecting rod is also weak. The billet rod has forced oiling through the dipper and an even oil clearance to allow just the right amount oil in and to keep it in at high rpm.
Kartfab: I have a predator 212 with stage 2 and then some done. Motor runs great. Only problem I have is it is dumping fuel out of the carb. I am running a Mikuni pulse fuel pump. The float is not sticking, the jets are clean and open, and the plunger works fine. Is it possible the small spring on the plunger is not strong enough for use with a pulse pump? I ask because at last nights race, all 3 karts that were running a pulse fuel pump were dumping fuel out of the carb. Or is there another known issue with running a pulse pump on these prepped carbs?
Here is some background to help you understand why its dumping fuel. So the float itself can only push up so hard on the needle, and the needle pushes up on the needle seat to keep more gas from flowing into the bowl when the bowl is full. So you have a gravity fed system (stock carbs) that works great unless you either don’t get enough gravity fuel flow, or you have to mount the gas tank lower than the carb itself. In the instances where you dont get enough (or cant get any) fuel flow, that is where you need a pulsed fuel pump. The problem is that the pumps pulse pressure pushing the fuel into the bowl via the needle seat overcomes the pressure that the float and needle are applying to the seat. The fuel fills the bowl, and at the top of the bowl, you have a vent to atmosphere. The air vent now becomes a fuel vent and it looks like the carb is “leaking fuel” but in reality the carb is completely full of fuel, ruining your air fuel ratio, and you are blowing excess fuel out of the air vent that is supposed to help with optimal metering of fuel as well. So what to do? If you run a fuel pump, you MUST run a needle seat that is SMALLER than the stock one.
How much additional horsepower will a stage 1 kit add to a predator engine
So is 902 hours good life for one these motors then huh and still running. All 902 hour was run allday everyday supply ing us with air o. The roof bang on them shingles
Total 9hp
How much additional horsepower will a stage 1 kit add to a predator engine
Does a person need to install the stage 1 upgrade for a 212 before the stage 2. And so on … I want to go as high as stage 2 but the places I have looked seem to be a stage 1 basic part then stage 2 replaces the same part a little better. Also is the billet flywheel for stage 2 ” really” necessary?
If you rev over 5000 than yes. The flywheel is dangerous.
Hey kart fab I’m new to this thread. Maybe you can help. We just built a stage 4 predator Hemi and we are having rpm issues. 1.2 rollers, 280 cam, +.020 rod, .050 milled head, 28.5 mm exhaust valve, mikuni 24mm flatslide. 44c comet 7.5 driven 5.00 gear ratio, 19 inch tires. No fuel pump.
Engine pulls very hard to about 3500rpm(38 mph) and stops building power.
Your thoughts would be greatly appreciatted.
torque converter is limiting rpm. Try jackshaft reduction and not gering so high (lower gear ratio number is bad with such large tires).
Can one install a oil cooler, boost bottle, and an expansion chamber exhaust on a new 212 cc predator hemi engine.
expansion chambers are for 2 strokes, a staged header would be better. Oil cooler? Not pressure lubed. Boost? dont mess with it, but some have put the small nitrous kit on theirs with some success.
I have a predator 212 with a few minor modifications that i race on dirt tracks. When i go to pull off the track, it wants to stall out and die when i let off the throttle. It seems to run fine on the track at full throttle however long i’m out there, just when i let off the throttle it doesn’t want to maintain idle. When i go to start it up right after it dies, it starts right up and stays idling like normal. Any ideas what would cause this issue?
idle pilot, idle speed screw, jetting.
I can’t find where to post a question at so I tried this route. I have a 1982 Yamaha G1golf cart, gas engine, it does a whole 12mph. So I yanked the engine, rear end, and generator plus exhaust. Giving it a 6 inch lift and I just purchased a 212cc predator engine, starting with stage 1 upgrade, wanting to know what is a good carburetor to get that will work with stage1,2,and possibly 3? I’m using a straight axle for the rear end now off of a 4 wheeler, and the clutch system off the golf cart, so its belt driven.
Genuine mikuni 22m roundslide with 130 main and 12.5 pilot, or a genuine mikuni 24mm flatslide with 140 main and 20 pilot
Chinese motors good. Chinese carburetor not so good!?
Hi i have done the same with my golf cart it was elect i took all the elect off installed a predator 5 horse…my problem is there is no speed can walk faster than this thing will go but has a lot of torque will climb a hill with 2 grown men on it..but i built it for a lil more speed which i dont have..do i need bigger engine or change my gears
Change your big sprocket to a smaller one for more speed.
Sounds like you have the sproket type clutch instead of a torque converter. You need a 30 series torque converter kit.
Need to vent fuel tank drill hole all the way through the cap and or put a vent mod on the vent hose line cut it and put a fuel filter on the end. Also cut the oil sensor wire off
Will you need the gaskets for this
You can reuse the old ones, but you can always use new.
Hi. I just installed a GoPowersports aftermarket Mikuni 22mm carburetor along with billet rod, flywheel, 22lbs valve springs, performance cam, and performance spark plug onto my predator 212. I can start up the engine with the choke on, but when the choke is on it revs very high which seems to be normal with the videos that I watched, but don’t want to go flying when starting it up on the ground if there’s any way to fix that. Also, unless the idle screw is set very high when it’s idling, it’ll just stall and its set too high to keep that way. Also it revs insanely high with the choke with high high I need the idling screw for it not to stall and I believe that there is something wrong and I cannot diagnose the problem. All help is very much appreciated! I’m only 14 and very new to this but videos such as yours have helped a lot with this subject. Thanks!
please look up mikuni 22 roundslide idle adjustment. You can adjust idle speed and all that stuff just with a screwdriver and your fingers.
Yea I’ve been adjusting the idle screw but unless it’s at a very high adjustment the engine will die. I’ve tried to look at articles and videos but it seems to be too specific of a problem and no one has posted anything about it.
I’ve tuned it differently several times and believe it may just be a factory issue so I contacted the seller.
The choke is actually an enrichment circuit and adds more fuel and unfortunately more air to the engine which causes it to rev to 2500 RPMs. Some people have fixed it by adding a small primer to squirt a bit more fuel into the engine. That way it will start and not over-rev since the enrichment circuit causes more RPMs you don’t need to use it if you have a primer.
while it is true that choke is an enrichment circuit, it will not cause over-revving. The throttle slide is typically closed, and the only thing that could cause over-revving is by adjusting the slide height too high, or opening the throttle while starting.
Will this set up work when converting a golf cart from electric to gas. What kind of speed with all the modes do you think it will get.
depends on gearing and target rpm.
I have a predator that is de governed with stage 1 and 18lb springs do I need a cam rod and flywheel?
So i just removed the governer on my engine and all wemt well except one of the valve rods fell out and I just had to put it back in so I faired up the engine end everything was good until I hit the throttle it just bogged down and died and it keeps on bogging it wont go away any help
Check your valve lash
Did you get this fixed? I’m having the same problem with mine.
Hi. I probably should have originally posted my comment in this section and I couldn’t find a delete comment button. I have a predator 212 and I am thinking about removing the governor. However, I don’t exactly know how to setup a new throttle linkage after you have tampered with the original one and would like you to help me by either making a video about it, or just instructing me on how to do this. Thank you. 😀
Ok i have 212 predator that i broke the rod in and a 6 hp honda motor that runs but the persons i bought this honda from cut the end of the shaft off so there is no bolt hole can i take the predator crank and put in the honda block so that ill be able to bolt clutch on? I keep running into dead ends
you can bolt the predator rod into the honda engine, but it will have a longer stroke and other differences. The predator has a 3.308″ length rod, and the honda has a 3.303″ length. Predator has a 1.188″ journal, and the honda has a 1.180″ journal. Finally, the predator AND the honda has a .709″ wrist pin. SO…. with that said. No. You absolutely cannot just bolt it all together and hope it works out. My advice to you would be to just buy a new predator engine, because if you broke the rod, then you probably were hot rodding the engine and scored the journal of the crank. If you are really cheap, you can just 1) attempt to tap the crank for the honda 2) buy a new crank for the honda, or 2) buy a new rod for the predator. Honda crank is $26 shipped, Predator connecting rod is $12 shipped.
I doubt they are the same dimensions. I’d say….check the specs on BOTH, to be certain. FYI: (VERY IMPORTANT!) It’s also recommended that you change the piston, rod, and valve springs anyway, to ensure that those components will be able to handle the added stress that undoubtedly, will be placed on the internal components, once the governor has been removed from the engine. But, even if you’re a daredevil……, and you decided to proceed with your mission…. if the parts you’re seeking to exchange are different in size, you can bore out the cylinder, or place a metal sleeve in the cylinder to compensate for the discrepancy. But, again…. know that its days would certainly be numbered if you removed the governor from the engine, and you didnt replace those parts with stronger components! Either way…… Good luck!
#PhantomRyder
#CatchMeOnAHighwayNearYou
*Sorry. I misread your question. Please disregard that, which does not apply. Good luck.
Hay kart fab I have a predator 212 but when I try to start it it has a lot more resisting pressure because I put 18 pound valve springs onto it any ideas
Probably messed up your valve lash.
Deff messed up ur valve lash. Intake is .004 and exaust is .006
Re; pull start snap back…
Hello kartfab! Glad to have found this plethora of karting info! I am new to the kart scene and Just built new Electric start lifan 420cc for my sons drag kart. So far, I’ve installed an Arc billet flywheel compatible for electric starter, and billet Bullfrog racing billet 4.450 rod. Few thou longer than stock rod so slightly higher compression. 50lb springs and HD rockers… removed mechanical governor and installed ud-2 cdi honda coil hoping to use charging coil and electric start, then I quickly realized the hard way, that the new flywheel requires the removal of the charging coil… I’m still considering a different charging system and left the starter etc on the engine for now. So I figured I could just pull start this thing for the time being. Finally adjusted the valves. I found many techniques online and decided to use a basic method: I adjusted the Intake valve when the exhaust valve was fully open to .004″ and opposite for exhaust valve I set to .005″ when intake valve is fully open. So. After pull starting a few times the thing started and I did a break in for it. Seemed to idle, run and rev very well. After I put fresh oil in it and went to fire it a second time the pull starter ripped out of my hand and smashed into my other hand injuring it quite severely. Anyway I left it for the day. I then read that I should pull the recoil slow up to just past compression stroke then pull hard . Tried that and still same problem. Then elsewhere read I should pull slow up to beginning of compression stroke then pull hard. I haven’t tried that yet. Which way is correct? I’m beginning to think my valve lash is not set correctly perhaps and this may cause the kickback. Could that be the culprit? As I just learned its reccomend to set exhaust lash just after compression release “bump” occurs. But will a minor few thousands
off lash cause such violent snap back? I dont believe the key on flywheel sheared as it’s new. Or am I simply wasting my time trying to pull this over with a billet flywheel? Because it doesn’t create the same inertia as the heavy cast one, will it just keep kicking back? Any help would be greatly appreciated as this thing is deadly hard on the limbs. Thanks!
i have a Honda GX 390 with 13.5:1 compression ratio and it can pull start it. You always ALWAYS adjust valve lash just past top dead center on the compression stroke. What i believe your issue is in an incompatibility between the ignition system and your flywheel, or at the very least your timing is very far off for some reason. The UT2 coil fires at a completely different spot than a UT1 coil fires. The UT1 and UT2 flywheels are actually off by quite a few degrees. So in short, TIMING is most likely your problem. switch to a UT1 coil (its the cheap standard coil) and VERIFY your timing with a timing light. Your timing should match your fuel and camshaft recommendations.
Can the frame be built out of wood instead of steel? I don’t have a welder and have never welded anything, but I am pretty good with woodworking.
Yeah, but I don’t condone it.
Hello I have you engine on my havoc m5 Go Kart but when I sart it it wants to just go. I have done things to slow it down and it worked. But it still wants to go. How would I get it to stay to where I can start it and it will stay and I can get in with out it moving? If you can answer this that would be awesome. Thank you
make sure the throttle return spring on the engine is working. There is a black screw on top of the carburetor that if you back it out enough, it will lower the idle speed. Idle should be around 1600 rpm. If the black screw doesnt control the idle speed, then you need to make sure the throttle linkages are working and not ‘bypassed’. Next, you need to check your clutch or torque converter. It may be dirty and is partially engaged. You may need to service and clean your clutch. Some clutches have springs in them, and over time they wear out, which may require them to be replaced.
Hey y’all, I’ve been working these predators and gx160/200s on almost everything I can the needs it! All of the Info I read is mostly always spot and hands together for that! If you don’t mind, I’d like to add a little insight of my own on this particular problem that mostly everyone encounters at some point. CENTRIFUGAL CLUCTHES NEED TO BE SERVICED EVERY 2-3 HOURS OF OPERATING TIME. Point blank. End of story. Most of standard clutches engage 1600-1800 rpm, so everything before that is being held back from the drive wheel by your clutch. Run the kart at idle for about 2 min or so, till your clutch is warm as metal is more porous the warmer it is. After warm, apply 2-4 Drops of oil, any oil is better than none at all, to the output shaft one either side of the clutch. Be careful not to get any lube into the drum or on the inside at all. Let the kart sit for 20 min and cool off, or all your oil will get slung right into everywhere you don’t want it. Lubricate chain and wipe excess oil away. These clutches are cheap, bit if you take care keep them over heating, they will last a long time! I’ve got 3 years on a 17.99 amazon special. I’m 200lbs riding a predator hemi minibike. I’ve rebuilt the Hilliard’s extreme duty once so far in the same amount of time, but it gets really abused.
Buy U-bolts and hardened 3/8 bolts, washers,and lock nuts since welding isn’t an option for you.
Hi I have size 13 rear wheel and 10front wheel size would you think a 212 predator motor move the tire or is it to much really interested to know
13″ and a 6:1 gear ratio with a regular centrifugal clutch should work nicely.
Our local 1/4 mile asphault track started a new 6.5 hp 212cc predator motor class. 12 tooth clutch, 30 tooth sprocket. 5″ or 6″ tires.
We unhooked the oil sensor, we unhooked the governor. We were having issues with mufflers so got track owner to agree to add straight pipes.
Now we are having issues with I believe vapor locking. 4-5 laps and karts die. Will start right back up.
I’ve heard of drilling hole through gas cap but would that cause issue with leaking fuel and safety.
Is there a certain clutch that works better than others?
Thanks
Kirk
Sorry 60 tooth sprocket not 30
get them to add fuel pump. you can drill gas tank no problem. It might actually be emptying fuel from bowl faster than it can get into the bowl. So if you are concerned about fuel leakage, drill and tap the gas tank cap and put in a one way check valve. They are used with motocross and dirt bikes all the time.
I have the new hemi flywheel in and now my pull start won’t catch it to pull …any ideas?
Check to see if the recoil is engaging the tabs that catch on the starter cup.
Does a 54 steel tooth sprocket get the same performance or a bit worse than a 60 tooth sprocket with the Monster Moto mini bike 3/4 10 t clutch on a predator 212 engine
The bigger the axle sprocket the faster your acceleration and torque will be but you’ll loose top end speed. Smaller axle sprocket has less torque and slower acceleration but higher top speed. Same rules apply to your tires as well
So I just went to go power sports to buy the 60 tooth sprocket but there out of stock and I’m planing to get the 54 tooth steel sprocket for a 420 chain. I’m 120 pounds would that workout or would it be too fast?
depends on tire size and clutch and jackshaft and size of what you are driving.
My predator 212 that has mod 2 cam and header , no governor also air filter and jet has a ticking noise coming from the head that is louder than the header and that push rods aren’t bent but I do not know about the valves being bent or not because it has compression. Motor will start for a second then die but there was oil on my head gasket had oil on it so I dont know if my gasket is blown or what is wrong with it if I could get help it would be greatly appreciated
did you check clearances when you put in the cam? Valve lash? Carb clean? Flywheel key? Basically, you could have messed up anything you touched so go back through it.
Mod cams on 212 pre. Need Clarence so they don’t hit crank
Just swapped the predator 6.5 on my Marco mini bike. Runs great but dies shortly after giving throttle. Also seems to run wide open with rear wheel off the ground. Using the fuel tank from mini bike but looks like I am getting plenty of fuel. Any Thoughts?
Dirty carburetor. Clean it.
We’re do I get the gas breather vent
Click on the kit link, you will see it there as an option.
what is the difference between a hemi and non hemi-ed moter because i have a hemi.
a bunch of differences, just know that you need to know if it is hemi or non-hemi only with stage 2 and above mods. Stage 1 is all the same.
thanks i was just wondering if there was a factory difference
One has a hemi head one dosent. He is have a better rocker set up compared to non hemi. Hemis have a shorter valve spring installed height so be careful choosing springs hemi s use a Honda clone block with a bigger bore there’s a ton I could go on
Hi kart fab
What is the max rpm on my stock 212 no governor
It depends. If you don’t do stage 1 upgrades you are restricting airflow and depending on load, you don’t know what numbers you are going to see.
Predator Engines, where can I get them here in Europe? The only webshops seling them are located in the US and they don’t ship ‘m to Europe.
Yes, we do have Honda GX clones here (Kohler, Lifan and other Cinese stuff) but no Predator, which appears to be a great engine.
Anybody, any ideas on how to get a Predator engine to The Netherlands, Europe…?
Best is best VALUE. A Honda is the best quality. If you get a different engine, a lifan is typically a clone, and other clones are clones of the gx200 (a 196cc engine) most clone engines that are 196cc engines, are ‘exact’ copies of the honda gx200 engines, but have less durable materials, especially the rubber stuff. If you do get a 196cc clone, so you can get performance parts for them as they are interchangeable with the honda gx200’s. A lot of times the clones have a different looking shroud, gas tank, muffler, and air box, but the stuff inside has the same dimensions.
Kartfab i need your help. I have a predator 212 Hemi 18 pound valve springs header open Style air filter air filter adapter no governor Tillotson TCT carburetor and all of the sudden everything went to hell in a handbasket it is running like complete and total crap no matter what I do it will not get right I have tried 3 different carburetors change the plug for X check my valve lash took the guts out the engine and put it back and it’s still running like crap it idles just fine but as soon as you hit the throttle it starts bogging and backfiring and just will not rev up without shooting flames
Well, it is bound to be something you touched. My guess is that you didn’t get the fuel mixture right, but could be a bent valve, valve lash, or flywheel key sheared.
Try seeing if you can get a Ducar 212 in Europe? Same as a predator hemi, but a better block.
sounds like the timing is off or a bent pushrod (exhaust side)
Check the key on the flywheel
harbor freight has them on their website. I think they will deliver to you
Tillotson’s Ducar 212 shipped from Ireland ? I like it better than the Predator. Better engine IMO.
get the tillotson, it beats the predator hands down.
Hello,
Wondering if the Predator 212 or even better 420cc would be an easy install on a Ace Maxxam 150 2R Buggy? Friend has one with seized engine and selling for cheap or is this buggy a POS? It was quite slow with original engine. Great site with great info!!
those buggies typically use a gy6 150cc engine, which has internal gear reduction. Im guessing the “R” also stands for reverse. It would be a huge headache to swap it out for a 420 or 212 involving welding, losing the ability to reverse, and figuring out how to put a larger axle sprocket on there (which may involve buying a whole new axle). In short. Fix what ya got, or buy a new engine. There are top end kits for this stuff so take that engine apart and see what is wrong. It might just need a new piston, rings, and jug.
after doing the upgrades, my engine wont rev up. it wont get to a very high rpm. we put the pipe on it the other day and it did great, then today we put the intake adaptor and filter on and replaced the jet and its not doing so good. they’re the only thing’s we’ve touched. i appreciate any help, thanks!
Skyler, it is something you did that caused this problem. Please go back and look at everything you touched. You could have put something on backwards, ripped a gasket, or not tightened the jet and it came loose, or your throttle linkage doesn’t allow you to open the butterfly all the way. Look at everything you touched and assume nothing.
You gotta adjust the carburetor
So what’s the in stock speed on a predator 212 and what do u think it will be on me I weigh 120 pounds
Speed is dependent on gear ratio and tire size. The engine will typically turn 3600-3800 governed.
Mine stock tops out around 20mph and I weigh around 150
How Much extra horsepower will the Stage 1 Mod along with the removal of the governor actually give me? I just put a 212 Predator on my mini bike and would like more top speed. Will this help me go 5 mph faster or more like 20 mph? Thanks in advance !
Those are all loaded questions. To give you a bit more information, you will be able to hit 5500 rpm. Do some math on your own and you will see how fast that is.
I just bought the stage 2 performance kit do u have to take the governor out or Can,i just leave it,in
you can keep it in, but why would you leave it in if you have a stage 2 kit?
I bought a race kart and put a 6.5 hp predator on it. I am planning on getting the intake, exhaust, and jet. I want this thing to be pretty fast but I’m nervous to remove the governor. I don’t want to get a new flywheel and stuff for it though. Will it be a bad idea to remove the governor without a new flywheel?
the connecting rod is what you should worry about. Try and just run it with the stage one mods https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTUQvR4A9Ds Once you do stage 1 mods, you can still have the governor intact. If you feel comfortable removing the governor, you will need to 1) upgrade the connecting rod, 2) upgrade to better valve springs. Inspect the flywheel for casting flaws and cracks. If you dont see any, then you can be relatively safe up to about 6k rpms. Clone box stock engines run theirs up to 7200 rpm with no flywheel issues. If you are going to do a lot of upgrades, what is more important to you, $100 or your life and health? Its good insurance.
check plug first… im at high altitude 3500′ so the plug that it came with is black=tooo much gas already so it needs a smaller jet than the .028 it comes with. they don’t sell SMALLER jets than .032 so hopefully with bigger exhaust and cone type air filter it wont be so BLACK on the plug from soot? from running rich?
I would recommend when taking the govener out replacing the valve springs to about 18lbs to prevent valve float (YOU DO NOT WANT A VALVE WELDED TO YOUR PISTON)
id be worried abt valve keeper failing with “too much” spring?? and dropping the valve… which would be catastrophic to engine. the ones that don’t have keepers anyway just cast iron, aren’t they?
I’m wondering why you guys are removing the governor? Can’t you just bypass the governor and externally modify motor to restrict the gov arm from pulling the carb shut? Seems a lot easier and not permanent.
The governor gear is plastic with metal tabs on it. When you ‘bypass’ the governor, the extra centrifugal force from the higher rpms makes that piece inside the engine a little grenade. You can do what you like, or spend 10 minutes and possibly a new sidecover gasket to do it the right way.
I’ve Tried this and you shouldn’t try this. Governmer gear is plastic and it exploded while reving high rpms and after the gear is gone the little arm which passes through the block is free to swing wherever it wants. In my case it swung over enough to hit my connecting rod several times eventually breaking loose the bolts holding my conecting rod together and rod began to knock then about one second later it tried to shove my piston through the cylinder sideways. Block scraped crank case scraped connecting rod scrapped and crank shaft scraped and fly wheel scraped from bypassing th governor! Only thing still good on it was the head the cam and carb. All this happened in about three seconds by the way.
I’ve put 19.7lb springs in mine and ran it for a year(roughly 30-40 races at least) and it has been fine.
I’m building up a Predator for use in my ultralight aircraft. I’ve seen a guy on YouTube who uses 2 of them on his Lasair with no problems so I’m confident it can be done.
Any tips or advice for building a motor which will turn high RPMs for extended periods? So far I’ve got the performance rod, 18lb valve springs, I’m using a carb that’s 24mm and is for a snowmobile, (I read they don’t cut out easily when tilted at strange angles) atm I’m going open exhaust, I’ve got the stock flywheel, (I have seen a stock flywheel turn 7400 RPM just fine so I’m dubious about the whole grenading flywheel theory below 10k) besides the heavy cast flywheel helps me get my CG where I need it.
I’m considering a mod 2 cam but figure I may try to get in the air with what I have.
Any advice is appreciated.
Wow I don’t know where to start. So #1, the flywheel has a negligible effect of your center of gravity. we are talking what, 5 lbs vs 3? What is most important is torquing the flywheel nut to spec when you change your timing. My general impression is that you are trying to do this on a budget, and that takes a back seat to safety. Here are a few items to think about. Box stock engines/predator engines run the stock flywheel and stock crank in box stock classes turning 6500-6700ish rpm. The most common causes of failure are spinning the flywheel (by not torquing it to spec) and connecting rod failure, because they just fail on modified engines. If you are going to be turning high rpms, you absolutely need a billet connecting rod. Then you have to ask yourself, if the engine blows, am i going to be ok whenever it blows? If you are ok with whatever answer, then go for it. If it were me, id check the flywheel for cracks or casting flaws, torque it to spec after having set my timing to wherever i want it to be. I would absolutely put in a billet connecting rod. The mod 2 cam works great. Maybe toss in a pair of champion shaft rockers, and get a set of chrome moly push rods. Advance timing to 28-32 degrees before top dead center, and put in a set of heavy valve springs. Whatever cam you get dictates timing, springs, and compression ratio. Have fun!
Cool thank you. I bought what was advertised as a “performance” rod? I don’t think it is billet because it was about half the price of all the billet rods I’ve looked at. It was lighter in color than the stock rod so maybe it’s something like a 4130 alloy? (I’m not sure about that at all I’m not a metallurgist) also not curious enough to take a Dremel to it and see if it sparks. Lol
I am trying to build it inexpensively, while also being safe. (Safe is a relative term here honestly.) I’m building what’s known as a “motor floater” basically a glider with a small engine, and I don’t plan on getting above ground effect till I’ve felt it out real good first. To be honest I’m a lot more worried about some structural failure than a loss of power at this time.
If you or anyone is curious I’m building a modified version of the Bloop 4 there are some videos of its creator flying it on YouTube. He uses a paramotor engine and the thing has handling characteristics similar to a paramotor, (takes off at about the speed of a good sprint, will maybe hit 40MPH in level flight with a tailwind, etc.)
A quick question about getting the timing advance set correctly. The stock flywheel is 24BDC correct? The motor is a predator non-hemi. If so I’d need the *6 timing key to hit the middle of the 28-32 range you recommend?
Have you thought about setting up a couple affiliate links to some of the parts suppliers? I’d gladly click through so you get credit for the sale.
I have a predator 212 on my daughter kiddie cart,w one-wheel peel. I want jazz up the acceleration and maybe get more mph. I font really want to open the case ….will an intake, jet, and exhaust do this? Also keep in mind that my daughter is ten and not very speed oriented, so half the time it will be throttled down (restricted) …basically I wanna spend 80 bucks and make it it look bitchin. The performace is for me when I’m playing around… So… Jets exhaust and an intake?
You got it man, That’s all you need. This is ‘Stage 1’ on the upgrade list. It is what you do first, and where you see the most gains.
I’m sorry if it’s been mentioned but I can’t seem to find it. On the predator 212, what effect (hp increase) will doing the intake, exhaust, jet without removing the governor? I ask because it’s for my sons bikes but I don’t want them blowing their engines by over revving them.
if you dont remove the governor, the engine will just have more power and the same reliability. it is literally the best power increase you can get from stock without compromising the engine. As long as you do the proper preventive maintenance, the engines will last for years to come.
You won’t have any more power. The governer will still limit the rpm to 3600
Michael, you don’t really understand much about engines. Adding a high flow intake, re-jetting, and high flow exhaust will most definitely provide substantial gains in power (both max hp and max torque). Keep studying and learning.
Michael it WILL have more power in the given rpm range. Higher RPMs don’t equate to more horsepower! Horsepower is equated by torque over time
I just bought a predator 212 to put on a cart and I have removed the governor and.working on the oil sensor and what I want to know is, is it better to simply disconnect the sensor wires and disable it, OR should I actually remove the unit from the engine? I heard some people say you can add more oil if you remove it, but my reasoning is that having the unit inside the crankcase would increase the oil level due to displacement so I feel like it would be better to leave it in and just disconnect it. I mean, I plan on changing the oil fairly regular anyway, so having more oil kind of seems pointless and God forbid maybe too much oil and screwing something up. Anyone have an opinion?
I personally remove mine, but it makes absolutely no difference. If you removed the governor, did you take the side cover off and remove the gear inside? Might as well pull it out when you are in there, but again, ask yourself, does it matter if the low oil sensor is in or out? Not really.
Yes I removed the entire governor. I decided to just leave the sensor in. I disabled it and installed a second kill switch by the steering wheel. Now the only issue I have is getting the throttle set just right. The screw that limits the throttle movement isn’t quite long enough to keep the throttle from pulling on the carb if the pedal is pushed all the way and really hard. Or if I set it to where it is long enough, then my throttle linkage I made from the old governor tang ends up holding it on idle instead of it resting in the proper idle position. What I need it a smaller spring so I can adjust the idle screw further out.
I just bought my son a go cart and will be learning about 4 stroke along side him. I am sure this site will be helpful!
Got a qiestion to gokart owners i have a fox 2 body gokart an i oit a 212cc oredator in it it hooked up an soon as i start it up it wants to jus sit with the choke on an not go anywhere even with hitting the throttle but once i put the choke off it takes off an it takes off fast like the throttle gots full speed what could be causing that
you dont have the throttle hooked up correctly, or you dont have sufficient return pressure to hold the throttle at idle. There is a friction nut on the throttle arm that should let the throttle be slightly loose. Could also be improperly adjusted idle speed screw (black screw on top of carb).
Sounds like you need a throttle return spring. The throttle isn’t releasing all the way. So it’s stuck open.
Greets. Hope all is well if I remove the gov.do I have to change anything else
You would have to do everything mentioned above in this article to get addiquite resources to the engine. I just dont advise removing the governer because the stress is dramatily increased and you may blow the engine
Removing the governor does not “dramatically increase stress and you may blow the engine” How about you go ask some of these go kart racers that turn their predator 212 or box stock clone engines 6800-7000 rpms all race long throughout their race season what they do with a STOCK ENGINE with stage 1 mods to accomplish this.
@KARTFAB: hey man I bought the stage 1 kit from you: long header air filter and adapter .038 jet and GX140 E-Tube I also purchased a Tav2 30 series torque converter. I have removed governor completely disconnected oil sensor set and reset valve lash to spec NGK plug. 20×10-8 Rear tires 15×6-6 fronts 60 tooth drive sprocket 10 tooth clutch/converter sprocket and before ANY upgrades with governor intact my speed was 42.8 mph after mods and gov removal with converter driven spring set in hole #1 I’m struggling to get 40 mph and it doesnt seem to be revving 5k+ you have any clue what could be going on here? I’m about ready to scrap this thing
it could be any number of things. Check to see that your throttle butterfly does in fact open all the way. Gearing with a heavy kart, and big tires plays a HUGE role in whether or not the engine can reach max speed, and a torque converter does prevent revving to higher rpms as well. You might want to try out the stock e tube and see if it makes a difference. You might be too rich. You could see if you can help the engine accelerate faster by putting in an 8t type c 5/8″ bore sprocket on the jackshaft instead of the 10t. It will have a lower theoretical max speed, but will put less load on the engine since you are changing up the gearing. This may allow the engine to spin more freely.
Greetings I’m getting a predator 6.5hp if I change muffler,intake only would it b faster and what jet size should I use after this and how much faster would it go can u email me Hyroller321@gmail.com Ty for all infor
Why is the rear of the predator engine inclined on racing go karts. Is there some performance advantage. It seems that it would affect float bowl operation.
I an no expert, but I know the reason that I have mine on a 15 degree angle is so the intake upgraded filter clears the rear wheel.
We cant ford 300 inline sixes 22 degrees so we can use the EFI intake lowers with a custom bolt on multi carb upper, so far there hasn’t been no ill effect
Some people even believe theirs an advantage, The logic is it takes less force to push something up a incline then lift it straight up so when the pistons are coming back up on a stroke its fighting less force?
My old Dragon Fly racing cart has such a mount and I add some extra oil knowing its pooling to the front of the case,
If somebody comes up with pros or cons please feel free to reply
thumbs up (y) i want to build my own gokart like you haha i hope so
Ok so I have a question. I have the 212 predator. I have just done the ARC flywheel, govenor removal, and added 26lbs valve springs. The distance on flywheel was set to 0.030 and the lash on valves was set to .003 as per what I have seen everywhere. The problem I am having is that everytime I try and start the kart there is a serious kick back. Could these springs be to much for the stock cam or should my lash be set differently? Any advice you can give me on this would be great.
The camshaft has a compression release on it. If you installed the cam wrong, or have no compression release, that would do it. Did you verify timing with the flywheel? A common mistake is not tightening the flywheel nut, which causes the flywheel key to shear off.
The cam was never touch. It the stock cam. The ARC flywheem has a built in 8 degree timing on it and I am using the stock timing key. The not has been tightened down to 54 lbs psf. I was thinking that maybe the 26lbs springs where to much for the stock cam.
Do you know how to pull start properly? its probably not the valve springs. With my briggs 5 hp flathead, if I don’t rotate it to the compression stroke, and yank hard, it kicks back. Just pull on the cord gently to turn the engine over till you feel resistance on the compression stroke, then let the cord wind back up, then pull gently until you feel that tension, then give it a yank. if that doesn’t solve your issue, pull out the plug and see if it rotates freely. If you accidentally had the engine upside down or have a gas leak from the carb, it could get into the cylidner and over-pressurize the cylinder head. Pulling on the cord with the spark plug out will clear the hole. If it rotates freely, then put your plug back in. B\ack to square 1, –> you have a compression issue related to camshaft and valvetrain, or flywheel not in the correct position in relation to top dead center. Kickback is caused by spark and/or valves doing their thing at the wrong time.
Ok sounds good, how do I make sure. My flywheel is in the right position in relation to TDC? Do I need to bring engie to TDC and than install the flywheel?
piston stop tool, degree wheel, timing light: these are the tools the pros use to get real world numbers, but not all of us are pros, or have $60 laying around to get those tools… so the simplest way to make sure your flywheel is still good is to take off the flywheel nut, then pull the flywheel and inspect the key. If it all checks out, then revisit your valvetrain and camshaft.
Thanks so much. I was finally pinpointed the problem. Looks like ny valve lash was set wrong. Once I adjusted it everything was perfect. Has a small little kick, but nothing to bad.
Hey there. I have a question. Sounds like you know what your talking about. I installed the stage 1 performance kit. Which i also got the arc billet flywheel. After i installed everything. The engine started right up. But after i drove it Maybe 2 mins. It stalled. And now. Won’t start. I wasn’t getting spark. So i replaced spark plug. Now it started. But it’s sucking in through exhaust. And spitting gas from the carb. And has serious kickback. I don’t know what to do about it now. Do you have any tips or advice? Someone please help me!!!!
brian, yep i know exactly what happened. You spun the flywheel. This happens when you dont torque the flywheel down to the proper specs. You likely have sheared your key or seariously damaged the key and keyway in the crank and flywheel itself. You can probably lap the flywheel to the crank pretty heavily to get rid of any minor stuff, but you will need to torque the flywheel down to proper specs, which is 65 ft lbs iirc. good luck!
I have 26 pound springs in a other than that stock one it runs good
Stock cam is not recommended with a billet flywheel or heavier springs because there is not enough lift with the stock cam lope. Buy a mod2 cam it is a cheap and reliable option that works well with the 212. I have a trail kart with a (almost) fully built non hemi (billet rod, mod2 cam, 26lb springs, hi compression billet head, stainless 5mm valve springs, plus stage one upgrades and a torque converter and I easily push 15-20 hp with great reliability. I removed my governor and I can rip at 7000 rpm without fear of slinging a rod or cracking a flywheel
so i have a go kart with the predator 212 that i am upgrading and a have a few questions. will the after market go power sports air filter fit on a mikuni 22mm carb and what other upgrades do you suggest note engine is stock
You need to measure the intake outter diameter and the air filter can be a tiny bit smaller than that (its rubber so it will stretch) or about the same size as the hose clamps on it. If you are doing intake, you need to do exhaust. Since you have a mikuni on there, it automatically has ‘bypassed’ the governor, so please take the governor internals out as a safety precaution. After that id do the billet connecting rod, and heavier valve springs and see how you like it.
thanks i have ordered the preformence kit that you show in your tips from go power sports will that exaust be good for the exaust and looking at getting alot more preformence mods for the engin what other sits shuld i look at
Can some one who weights 270 ride with a 212cc engine and will it drive
Yep but the acelleration might not be as fast as a smaller person
I have a predator 212cc engine and it runs and I’m in the middle of moving it onto another body (frame) and it will start and everything, but it won’t idle unless it is on choke so when I turn the choke off it dies unless I rev up the engine then it will run but as soon as I let off the throttle it dies so in wondering what I need to do to get it to idle?
clean the carb
Im having the same problem and i have already cleaned the carb and still the same problem
Bigger carb main jet
lol im 330lbs and my coleman 196 ct200u pulls me great! about same as 212 predator motor. same hp. a re gearing is well worthit! i went from a 50 to a 60 tooth rear sprocket! awesome gains.
My gokart weighs 150lbs and I was told 250 is the combined passenger weight limit, as to not overload the engine. 400 lb total work load limit. But I am not a mechanic.
I bought my daughter a go kart with a predator 212cc engine. It has been an experience being that I don’t know anything about engines. Anyway the starter recoil wasn’t pulling. She removed it to see if the rope was caught up…long story short we bought a new one and put it on today but it still won’t pull. I read that the engine won’t start if the oil is low and I checked it and it’s almost black so we will change the oil – my question is would the oil being low/obviously nasty be a reason for not being able to pull the starter? Sorry if it’s a stupid question but I am trying to learn…
hmmm good questions. From the sounds of it, with the engine oil being black, that this go kart engine is used. Do some basic looking at the engine, make sure the gas tank has gas, the kill switch is set to ON, fuel lever on carb is set to ON, and the choke is ON when starting (try flipping to OFF if you cant get it to start after a few pulls). When you say the engine wont pull, as in it wont turn over? Take out the spark plug and pull on the cord, if it wont start, your engine is either seized or has some serious problems internally (e.g. broken). If you can get it to turn over (not start, just rotate), then you go to the next step; hold the sparkplug edge (the big hex nut looking part) to any bare metal on the engine while pulling the cord. You should see a little spark jumping the gap. An engine in a nutshell needs air, fuel, and spark. So if you have spark, you need to check air. This is easy, just remove the air filter and check to see if its dirty (they need to be really clogged up to not deliver air). If it seems ok, go down to an autoparts store like oreiley or autozone and buy a can of carb cleaner (or starting fluid) spray a tiny squirt down the hole that the air filter covered. Turn the choke to off. Pull start the engine. It should start within 2-3 pulls and run only for a few seconds. If it only runs for a few seconds, you have a fuel delivery issue where the gas tank, fuel line, and carburetor need to be cleaned out thorougly. If it doesn’t start, then good luck haha!
Hi kart fab. I took your advice on the 212 predator and removed the governor and upgraded the exhaust jets and intake. Before I installed jets and intake I already had pipe. Now that I removed the governor and upgraded intake I have lost top speed. I top out at 35 when top speed used to be 40. Any idea Why?
Jeremy, you messed something up that isn’t caused by the high flow intake, exhaust, or jetting. The intake/exhaust/jetting will allow the kart to run (combined with other modifications) to an extremely high rpm (we got a kart with just the intake/exhaust/jetting to hit 60 mph). Sit back for a second and ask yourself. What parts did I touch on the engine? Anything you touched, you could have messed up. My guess is that the throttle linkage setup you have isn’t fully opening the throttle butterfly, and you will need to adjust it or install it properly.
I have new throttle cable and handle on the way. I will reevaluate. Although when I pull throttle I see that the throttle arm on the carb does move as far as possible both ways. Would the vacuum lines (or lack of now) that were attached to the old air box make a difference now that they are no longer there?
No. The gas tank vent line and OHV breather tube are for vapor recovery and provide no benefit to performance. They should be vented to atmosphere. Again, please go over everything you touched, and try a go kart forum where you can post pictures for lots of help.
Hi kart fab. I have just recently bough another predator 212 engine (used) and the previous owner has removed the govener. My question is how long can i hold down the throotle during rideing it im worried that my engine would blow up if its held down for to long. I have looked all over google and you tube to find the max time but had no luck im thinking you know and could possibly help me
There is no answer to your question, that is why you couldn’t find it. Engines dont just “blow up” or have some magical timer in them. The most common causes of engine failure (often catastrophic) once you remove the governor are valve to piston contact when you float the valves on an OHV engine, oil starvation on the crankshaft journal, or flywheel shattering. If you want to avoid those things, you get a billet connecting rod, billet flywheel, and valve springs appropriate for your target max rpm. Again, there is no answer to your question.
Hi Kartfab. Can you please tell me what clutch to sprocket set up and what size tires were used to achieve the 60mph? Thanks
no but i can tell you that you will burn up your clutch trying to go that fast. If you want to go 60 mph, i don’t want to be a part of it. You can search go kart speed calculator and put in all the data that is needed and it will spit out a number for you.
What oil should I run in my 212cc stage 2 motor with ported heads ?
10w30
In one of your videos, I noticed that you use Amsoil (it appears so anyway) I’m actually a dealer and I’m curious which “flavor” you prefer in a predator? I’ve been wanting to order some with my next order, but I’m not sure whether to use the small engine oil or the Amsoil/Briggs 4T oil.
Also do you use break-in oils or additives, or just dump straight Synthetic in from the beginning? Thanks
for regular karts, synthetic mobil 1 10w30 for break in and riding around. For performance builds, i use the royal purple break in oil and royal purple HPS synthetic to protect cam and lifters. Amsoil would be a good one as well as long as it has the ZDDP in it to protect cam lobes and lifter surfaces.
I have a 212cc Predator engine with some modifications which include haters, sprayers, and intake. And it’s not a hemi engine. What else can I do to make it faster and I did not want to remove the governor.
Ok, so I have no idea what ‘haters and sprayers’ are…And to answer your question, you cannot make your engine ‘go faster’ at all without removing the governor. When I say you cant make it ‘go faster’, I am referring to the maximum governed RPM of the engine. If you want to make whatever you have your engine connected to (I’m assuming mini bike or go kart) go faster while maintaining the same maximum governed RPM, you only have two options. 1) get bigger tires and/or 2) change your gear ratio through clutch sprocket or axle sprocket changes. Faster= more teeth on clutch (or torque converter jackshaft)
I got a predator 6.5 I got a new carb put on it runs but if I try to gas it all the way it wouldn’t go it would wanna shut of do you know what could be the problem ?
Could be a number of things. Did you change anything else?
after each mod, around what hp will the engine get to? also what type of clutch would you recommend?
depends on which mod, but what I suggest is that you do modifications in stages because some mods (e.g. jetting) wont work without the others (e.g. intake and exhaust). So the first mod would be the intake/exhaust/jet, the next mods open you up to a lot of options, but you typically see the next step being a high risk to connecting rod failure and sometimes flywheel failure, so you get a billet rod and flywheel with the governor removal to unlock higher rpms. After that, there are so many combinations to look at, that your specific needs dictate which parts you get. For an all around good performer, you advance 4-6 deg timing, mild (low lift, high duration) cam, and heavy valve springs and call it good. Again, there are so many more combinations out there that i could write maybe 20 or so articles on it and only be scratching the surface.
thanks for the info i just bought a predator 212cc getting ready to go get another one thanks for the mod info
Will any of each engine flywheel work on the predator 6.5?
A flywheel designed for the predator engine will work on the predator engine.
Is it possible to change the engine to a larger predator engine on the deluxe live axle go kart and if so whats the largest engine that would fit.
yeah, there have been a couple guys that have done the 420cc predator with the bolt on 40 series and its more than enough engine. If you want to put the predator 620 on there, good luck, its a huge engine and will have too much torque. It will fit though… you may need to build the frame slightly longer (up to 6″) in the engine mount area so you still have plenty of leg room so the seat can clear the engine. No mods to 420/frame to have it fit.
I am racing a predator 212cc with the governor removed. What can I do to get my kart to go faster? Modified cam? New to racing.
to make your go kart faster, you just do what I suggested in the article for the highest increase in performance. After that, you do the springs, cam, etc. There are plenty of other performance modifications, but you need to find out on your own what works the best for your your needs (e.g. max rpm, torque, power band, will pass tech, etc. Beyond that, here are the safety items at increased rpms (connecting rod and flywheel) and then there are the valvetrain upgrades that would depend on max rpms and cam (lifters, valves, pushrods, rockers, retainers)
What type of a clutch do you use? I use a max torque clutch but I am not entirely enjoying it.
Why are you not enjoying it? You will need to explain what the problem actually is before I can recommend anything. A lot of times, people buy a go kart that originally had a torque converter on it, that has been converted to a centrifugal clutch – in these instances you want to go back to a torque converter. Other times (same problem), people are wanting to make their go kart faster, then gear it so poorly (for high speed) that the go kart no longer accelerates well, and burns up the clutch before it can even reach that speed. What I am getting at here is that GEARING is a huge deal, so make sure your gearing is good for the weight/tire size/engine and track. If you are racing your go kart, the difference between a standard centrifugal clutch (maxtoqrque etc) and a disc clutch (noram cheetah, bully) is night and day, but some classes may not allow them. A good step up from the maxtorque, would be the noram GE, but it is still a crappy little centrifugal clutch, and if your gearing is off, then you wont like it either. All the higher classes of racers use the disc style clutches with the 4 stroke engines as far as i know.
I got the same engine on my kart and it runs great i am light and the go kart is very light as well since it has no roll cage and all rhat fancy stuff but i hit around 40 mph on it max but i have one problem woth my kart i dont know much about go karts since this is my first one and im new to the whole thing but my front wheel wobbles and it seems loose even though it is not ive looked into it and i think its a bent rim but i cant really tell if its bent on my kart it also doesnt touch the ground sometimes either only on that wheel so when i hit the gas the go kart will turn slightly giving it that feeling like your about to loose control but if its a bent rim can i heat weld it since i have a guy that is a professional heat welder and also can you give me some ideas of what else it kight be thank you
u can make a steering assit to keep it from wobbie find a small shock real lite like the kind that are on hatch back like blazer or even just one that holds a rear window make sure u can push it shut easy with ur hand get some small u bolts mount it to u turn buckles or tie rods make sure theres enough travel so u can turn both ways it will stop the wobble the little cylinder keeps it steady if u look up steering assist for 4x4s trucks it will show u what i mean its a smaller verison same thing keeps ur truck stable so ur front wheel dont shimmy check it out on4 wheel drives u can get the hatch shock at a junk yard i put one one my 660 rapure raceing quad
After all the basic modifications to the 212cc engine how fast do you think it’ll go? Also is it just worth it buying a bigger Predator engine ?
I just dynoed my predetor 6.5 after doing mods note these mods were done to a brand new motor never seen oil non hemi model ..air intake and filter adapter .. removed govener pulse pump fuel pump …. Stiffer valve springs ..and carb jet…put oil in first start on Dyno …..end results 11.4 hp and 14.6 ft lbs trq
PS exhaust pipe is very short stubby
Cool. Just the intake/exhaust/jetting is the best bang for the buck.
I’m planning on running to about 95 to a 100 mph with a predator 212cc engine . I’m want to put the engine on a doodle bug d30 frame and I need some help on gear ratios , and what others parts necessary for I can reach my goal. thanks email me @mikelwilliams718@gmail.com if you can provide me help
Well, i do not condone this, and you will probably never make it that fast. If you do even approach those speeds, you will likely die from the crash as the db30 has a very narrow base. Here is an article that goes over the Bonneville salt flats, and what a team of guys did to get to 73 mph on a much larger frame. Good luck, and please dont take this as an insult, but you shouldnt want to go that fast on that mini bike, as death or serious injury is very real, and there is no reset button in life. https://www.affordablegokarts.com/bonneville.php
Hey kartfab,
Just acquired a Pred212cc and am planning on all the simple stuff, ungovern/intake/exhaust/e-tube/jets. I was wondering why (or why not) I should get a billet flywheel as an upgrade as well?
I’m also curious what is the next step towards upgrades as in, what’s the best path to take (i.e. springs, connecting rod, piston ect.) ?
If you do upgraded springs, you need the billet rod. Piston is only for serious upgrades. Upgrades depend on your target, as there are so many different combinations. Flywheel is debateable, and only really required if you are revving very high (ine xcess of 5500 rpm)
Hey kartfab,
Awesome stuff, thank you much for that info. I don’t really have a direction yet but may plan on circuit racing, we’ll see.
I just finished installing an intake/exhaust/re-jet/ungovern engine, but now my engine will not start. I have ignition ( blue sparks on grounded frame ) and I’m positive that it’s getting fuel. Any ideas?
If you opened up the engine it could be that you forgot to align the dots on the cam/crank gear. It could be that the valvetrain is messed up somehow (check lifters, and make sure the pushrods are set in the little pockets on the lifters and rocker arms, then check/set valve lash. When you remove governor, you remove the engines ability to hold throttle wide open at start. Choke on, throttle wide open, then start. Obvious (but overlooked sometimes) is make sure the kill switch is set to ON 🙂 hope that helps!
i need help with a honda oddssey 1977-1981 i nwed info on motor and need to know hiw to identify a hemi motor
Hi KartFab,
Got a stock Predator 212 non-hemi, governor still installed. Recently upgraded carb (.615 venturi, .022 idle jet, .038 main, stock e-tube) plus air filter & header. Gas delivery to carb is fine. The bike runs decent but sputters in mid to high RPMs. Do I need a bigger e-tube and possibly different size jets? Any advice you could give would be appreciated.
.035 to .038 main is fine for a stock venturi. The larger you go with the venturi, the bigger you need to jet because you lose the venturi effect and the airflow across the venturi slows down. You not only need to base jetting on how the engine runs, but what the plug looks like. Id definitely get a “140 e -tube (its just a honda gx140 emulsion tube btw with a bigger opening at the bottom and fewer air mixture holes so you get a better fuel signal at the venturi). .038 is usually a good jet size for the predator engines btw.
Thank you sir. I will check plug for lean/rich. And thank you for providing this site & your knowledge, it’s awesome.
I have a Yerf Dog 3203 with a stock predator 212, it pulls pretty well, but if I set the choke to “run” it just bogs down and dies when I hit the pedal. It runs fine when it’s set half way between “start” and “run”., what could this mean. Also, is there anyway I would be able to tighten my brake band down in the rear? Through the cable at all?
1) you have a partially clogged jet in yoru carb, clean yoru fuel system out (tank, filter, fuel line and carb)
2) brake bands are simple. Not sure. Check manual.
Is your yerf dog a larger cart ? If so how does it pull I have a twister kart full suspend tin and thinking about using the 212 cause I got it for free !!
depends on how you gear it, a large two seat go kart should have a predator 420 on it in my opinion. The yerf dog i had was very light and small, even then it had a 7″ driven, and was geared for only 28-30mph.
I’m not able to do the intake, air filter or exhaust due to rules at a track. Is it worth rejetting without doing any of the others?
The question you should ask yourself is this, what is the purpose of the jet? You need to step back and look at 1) what a performance modification actually does, and 2) if you do that modification, what will the result be.
Heres an example: A bone stock engine is properly jetted. When you add a high flow intake/exhaust, you introduce more airflow into the engine, which throws off the fuel to air mixture, which requires re-jetting the carb to restore that lost fuel to air ratio. So when you ask me, is it worth re-jetting if you don’t do anything else, all I hear is “is it worth it to change the jet size in a properly jetted engine?” Sounds silly doesn’t it? If you change the jet size too large, your engine will run rich, be sluggish off the line, and may shoot out black soot. It will have reduced torque. If you run your engine too lean with a small jet, it will heat up too hot, not have torque, not reach higher rpms, and may actually seize. I hope that helps. If you want a miniscule edge, you take your engine to a professional engine builder, and have him make minute jetting changes to slightly lean it out at operating rpms for an edge.
I’m trying to find a stock air filter element. The air filter box lid is a clip on and has the sloped front. Anyone one know if a particular Honda or brigs filter would fit?
Look at the parts diagram in the users manual, it lists the part number. Google the part number and you will find plenty of places. If all else fails, you order it from harbor freight direct.
With this engine and these mods how good will the acceleration be?
I have a 212 CC Predator motor that I just got every time I go to make a right turn it stalls out what is the problem???? Maybe out of all the list of comments this one’s already been answered but it’s a long list of comments to go through thank you
Easy fix, its your low oil cut off sensor, which everyone disables. Locate the yellow wire that looks like it is coming out of a nut on the front lower portion of your engine block. Follow that wire into a little bundle of wires, and un-clip the wire bundle. Disconnect the yellow wire (it has a bullet connector) from that bundle of wires, and secure the bundle back together with that plastic clip. This wire is not needed for operation and you should always check the oil level before you run your engine from now on.
My predator 212 mL did the same thing when I did it right turn come to find out if your gas tank gets low to low like maybe like a hat to a half maybe a little bit more than a half it and hit a right turn makes the gas was around in there and the thing that sucks the gas up don’t get gas I started out but I always feel not next to it filled at all times and it won’
Check your gas to gas gets low maybe to a half a tank or a little lower somewhere around in there every time we do a right turn is going cut off because of that piece inside the gas tank sucks to gas up and when you go to spin your right turn the gas don’t get to it so do it with gas and then just try to write turns and I guarantee you it’ll work DRETT
Ok so. I bought the intake, muffler, and the drilled jet on amazon; with that being said i can go ahead and remove the governor and not worry about anything else? I also have a few questions but they’re pretty extensive but they’re all on the predator 212cc. Maybe someone with experience can email and give me a 1 on 1 run through. Here is my email > xmalcomisbeast5@gmail.com
A lot of people new to modifying engines have the same questions, so please post here I usually reply within a week or less. When removing the governor, you need to actually fill the hole the governor sat in. You can get a cheap tap and die set at harbor freight and tap some threads in it and use some threadlocker and secure the hole with a bolt. All parts of the internal governor have to go out. You would need to either jimmy up a throttle linkage, which is pretty easy, but can break your carb throttle if you dont have a travel limiter set up on your gas pedal. Ahother great option is like a $6-$35 part you can get on amazon/ebay, wherever “direct throttle linkage”
I just bought a 212cc go cart off of facbook and it wont idle i turn it on and it accelerates , the clutch is good tho . It has a car sparkplug in it , i dont know if thats why when i push the gas it bogs i just need info on how to make this peice of crap
probably needs a good carb clean.
What is the max hp a fully modded predator can handle. Someone told me he had 80hp I call bullshit.
Ronnie, you would be correct. One thing people tend to overestimate is the hp rating. There is no way to actually know the hp rating unless you take it to a dyno and they measure the hp and torque at a given rpm. So, with that said, please understand that upgrades are like trees, the trunk is all the same (the predator 212cc), and each time you do an upgrade, you branch off higher. There are many, many combinations of upgrades that could result in a ‘fully modded’ predator, just like there are many leaves on a tree. With that said, your friend may be pulling 10 hp out of his little predator, who knows. Nobody really without the dyno slip. The fact that someone even mentioned 80 hp as a max is a true testament to their ignorance.
80 hp is a absurd claim. I think one could increase the 6.5 hp rating by half with the intake , jetting , exhaust mods and governor removal . Close to 10 hp should be fairly easy
I have seen Dyno reading from some built Predators with big cams, big carbs, custom exhaust, etc,, etc. that are in the mid 30 HP range. It all depends on what you want o do with the HP. A couple of years ago two builders had a build off with the HONDA GX200 and one produced 45 HP for 30 seconds and that was the end of that engine. The more you upgrade the Predator engine the less reliable it becomes.
I want to remove the fuel tank from the engine and use the tank i have on the front section of my kart. I know i’d need a fuel pump but how can i do this as there’s nothing on the internet!
ethan, there is plenty of information on the internet. You need to just search for things the right way. Look for pulse pump installation, go kart fuel pump, how to etc. there will be three hoses coming out of the pulse pump, one goes to the carb fuel inlet, one goes to the fuel tank (which needs an inline filter btw), and the final hose goes to the pulse fitting. Pulse fittings can be installed on the carb insulator (some aftermarket insulators come pre-installed with one) or the crankcase cover, or the valve cover. Some modification may be necessary to install the pulse fitting, or you may need to purchase a new insulator or valve cover with that fitting already there if you arent willing to put forth the effort to modify your own.
Hope that helps!
What about the hole that we taped from the governor linkage
tapped? Yeah, you can use whatever hole you like.
Hello. I have a go kart (one seater) with a stock predator 212cc. I wanna add performance parts n take out the governor but i want to know what exact things im gonna need to put on the predator (am i going to need a new flywheel or add a special rod or a direct throttle, etc.) after removing the governor so i dont fuck it up.
depends on max rpm. for most people if you LEAVE THE STOCK SPRINGS IN you only need to do intake/exhaust/governor removal/and re-jet. If you are getting new springs, id FOR SURE get a new connecting rod. The flywheel is the last upgrade id do on an engine, and even that is debatable.
So I just bought a mini bike with the predator 6.5. The chain seems to fall off when I get going a bit. Is there a good way to tighten the chain or should I look at something else?
Thanks
Yes, there are ways to tighten the chain tension. Most mini bikes either have slots in the engine mounting plate that let you move the engine forward or rearward, or have some type of axle adjustment bolt/lock nut-nut combo on the rear axle. What you should do is put the mini bike centered on a 5 gallon bucket, then spin the rear wheel to make sure the sprocket is not out of round. If that checks out, take a straight edge (like a long level or piece of straight metal) and put it flat against the axle sprocket, it should line up perfectly with the clutch sprocket on the mini bike. If those two things check out, then you can look at chain tension. You want chain tension to be not super tight, but not loose. You can press on a properly adjusted chain with your finger and still have some flex in the chain. Keep in mind that mini bikes and go karts are not precision made machines, so you would need to check tension by rotating the engine or rear wheel a couple times to make sure its not too tight at a certain spot of rotation. Hope that helps!
And most certainly, MAKE SURE YOUR CHAIN IS NOT STRETCHED! This happened recently to me, thought the chain was loose. Upon closer inspection I noticed that the chain was fully engaged in the driven sprocket, but in the bottom the chain had enough slack that it would allow the chain to jump a tooth. So I would take your chain, disconnect the master link (hopefully you have one!), and wrap it around the large driven sprocket. If the chain appears tight and engaged on one side and loose and ready to fall off, it’s time for new chain!
Ya, move the engine and tire so their lined up and tight.
I’m building the fixed axel two seat go kart from the plans and was wondering if the 6.5hp 212cc engine was the biggest one that would fit on the kart, or could you go bigger and more powerful without messing up the torque or running out of space?
A few people have put the predator 420cc with bolt on 40 series torque converter on it, and it mounts to the existing plate if you got the standard or deluxe live axle kit. You may need to tack weld the plate on and possibly move it back a tiny bit so the seat slides backward, but it definitely fits. The kart is really torquey and can do donuts easily in dirt with that engine. Same top speed though (33-35 mph)
Hey Kartfab I have a problem with my Hemi 212. I removed the govenor than put some carb/injector cleaner in the tank. I put it back in the bike and started it up. It ran real high in choke than ran like absolute trash in run. I would hit the gas and it would sputter and not get any fuel or combustion but when i let off it idles fine. ???? Do fuel additives affect the energy that gas contains?
The cleaner stuff is garbage. You should never use it in that instance. Plus you have no need for it anyway since it’s not fuel injected. Also, the concentration used in a 10 gallon tank vs maybe half gallon is something to think about. You probably just ruined your gas by adding too much. Empty your entire tank, and clean your carb like you should (if it’s dirty) then use regular pump gas. Fuel additives are not in any way beneficial to your engine, nor is higher octane (premium gas) unless you had your compression ratio changed to 10:1-11:1. The only additive I use in my gas is the fuel stabilizer that helps reduce the harmful effects of ethanol and keeps it fresh for up to 1 yr. it’s called ‘Stabil’
I am having trouble with my mini bike that I put a predator 212 on. I did the performance upgrades, but now everytime I start it up, it runs for a few seconds, and then dies. if I try to unchoke it, it stalls immediately. Also, when I can get to the throttle fast enough, when I rev it it just sputters, revving high, and then low, and then high, and so on.
I will leave a link to a video of my problem:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iS7vJFxuD8&feature=youtu.be
Your governor arm is acting funny, like it’s engaging too soon. Did you jack up your governor linkage or governor arm bolt? You can adjust or remove it at this point… Might want to remove it and try a direct linkage. I’m not sure what you did, but it could be running lean. Did you rejet? Are all carb gaskets installed properly? Carb clean?
It’s a brand new cateburetor, rejetted. How do I do a direct linkage?
I also just made sure the gaskets are fine, and they are.
Hi I have the preditor 212. Engine only runs with choke on. I’ve cleaned the carb and checked for air leaks but everything seems sealed. When choke id turned off engine dies unless already full throttle. Also the air filter box seems to be blowing air when filter is off and intake is open. Bought used
check gaskets from the intake side all the way in. There is also a gasket that people seem to lose between carb and airbox. Sometimes gaskets are reversed accidentally. Next, clean your carb for real. Take out emulsion tube and jet. Also pilot jet etc. Could be the idle pilot jet.Its just running lean, and you gotta figure out why its running lean, which usually is an air leak after the carb, or partially blocked jet(s).
Hey kartfab how can i buy a go cart engine in india.have you ever heared about india
Building a 212cc bicycle now using a26in Schwinn Blackwell…..I ordered the small pipe and high flow air filter with jet change…. also got a torque converter… trying to figure out the proper gear ratio
oops i accidentally asked it twice
When removing the stock airbox, there are 2 hoses. the gas tank vent and the crankcase ventilation hose. Installing an aftermarket air filter will not have a place to plug those hoses in. So what would you recommend to do with them? Im wondering if I could just put on tiny air filters for both connections
the tank hose is a one way check valve, so you dont have to do anything with it actually. The crankcase vent hose should be vented to a catch can, or you could put a little air filter on it.
You can buy a little filter that you can put on the ohv hose but I have no idea what to do with the other hose
I used a hole punch and put holes in the rubber base if the new filter. Had to get a longer hose for crankcase vent. Thenjoy I sealed the hose in with silicone. Have put about 5 hours on it with no issues.
i have a predetor 6.5 hp 212cc motor on a mini bike ,ive installed the high peformance air filtr and exhaust and rejetted the carb ,also have removed the govenor. After about ten runs around the block {not all at one time} the piston slammed the plug put a hle in the piston and bent a valve and a pushrod.any suggestions on how to prefent it from happening again?
Hmm something is not adding up. If you over rev the engine, you could get valve float which can cause what you explained in an OHV engine. If you plan on taking the engine up to about 5500 rpm, you could get by with heavy valve springs, and a billet stick length connecting rod. If you rev past that you could spin or grenade your flywheel.
Can you run a 212cc engine with a upgraded air filter , jets and gov removed with 18lb valve springs and be okay ?
thats a loaded question. If you are upgrading valve springs, you should upgrade the flywheel and connecting rod.
Dear Sir- About how many more horse power did you gain? Is your engine 10 hp yet. Or more. Thanks koors675@aol.com
You would need to test it on a dyno. Anybody that says othwerwise without the dyno numbers is just making stuff up. Also, HP is dependent on rpms, and there is no real ‘standardized’ way of reporting hp across brands. E.g. hp at 3600 rpm vs 5252 rpm vs peak torque. All of this is modified by modifying the engine.
I need help my 212cc predator engine wont start. It was cranking fine then nothing. I took the carburetor apart cleaned it but one problem I had with that was I cant get my main jet to break loose to take it out. So I cleaned the rest of the carburetor and put it back together and still nothing. Any suggestions?
Mike, it could be any number of things. Please do not cut corners. I can virtually guarantee that if gas has been in your engine for more than a month and it worked before, but now it doesn’t, that you have a fuel delivery problem – IF you didn’t change anything on the engine. So with that said, clean out the tank, tank filter, fuel line, and carb. Giving up and putting it back together, then asking for suggestions will just give you the same answer that you already know; which is – REMOVE THE JET and emulsion tube, clean it out very well first. Just last month I spent about 10-20 messages back and forth between a guy that just couldn’t get this engine to run right – at the very first, he was like you, he KNEW he needed to clean the carb, and he said that he DID (but 3 weeks later and lots of frustration later he conceded to me that he actually couldn’t remove the jet on his carb, and that it was his jet that was clogged and three weeks of troubleshooting on his own terms, and his own ‘expertise’ weren’t enough to just do what you KNOW you need to do. Unscrew the jet, and clean the jet and emulsion tube out. If you cant unstick the jet, please get the right size flathead screwdriver to do this with. You can set your engine up on a bench, clamp it down, and undo the carb fuel bowl, then access the jet from underneath. You can really get some torque there to break it loose. Hope that helps, and please dont cut any corners here: do what you already know you should do 1st.
Should the clutch have some play? Goes in and out like 1/2″. Chain keeps coming off. Couldn’t move the motor anymore forward so took off a link and adjusted the motor and still poppped off.
some clutches have a set screw on them. If the clutch has play in it and you cant secure it with a set screw, then you need to get a spacer to push up against the clutch, then a flat washer against the spacer, then the bolt to secure it all to the engine shaft.
Got it! Thanks for the advice!
My son is rebuilding his go kart for a high school class. The Predator isn’t certified for CA, and the school has denied his request for it the funding to get the motor because of that. What do you recommend?
I reccomend getting the ‘CA certified’ motor. There are different versions on harborfreight.com so you just have to look around and find the right one.
This is the only way I know how to post here, but I have this engine in a go kart and when you make hard right turns it shuts down. Pull the cord and it fires right back up. I figured maybe not enough oil in the case and it’s rushing away from the sender but you can only get so much oil in it from the two filler caps. Any thoughts?
Disconnect the low oil sensor. Look for a wire coming out of the base of the block, its a bullet connector (ususally yellow wire). Just check your oil before you ride it. I do this on all the go karts I fix up.
Harbor freight has CA approved predator 212cc engines that meet EPA regulations. Link to the engine:
http://www.harborfreight.com/65-hp-212cc-ohv-horizontal-shaft-gas-engine-epa-60363.html
A HONDA GX 196CC
I have a predator 212 I put an air intake, preformance exhaust, re jet the carb #36 with the emulsion tube that came with the jet kit. With these mods ran great. When I put the 8* timing key on the flywheel shaft ran good for about ten min now it won’t start and some times rips the starter chord out of my hand what happened?
Could be any number of things but I bet you didn’t torque the flywheel down to 65 ft lbs, and you sheared the timing key. Take off the flywheel and see what happened. Also, could be valve lash.
Will do. thanks
Same thing happened to me, ended up being a pushrod
Hey love the thread and the simplicity to get your cart to the next level provided by the site thanks! I have installed the intake exhaust and rejetted the carb. Runs awesome! I have just removed the gov also. And ordered the billet rod and flywheel. I have read some about cam and spring upgrades. How much more could i get with those? And also what about an entirely new carb. Your recommendations are greatly appreciated. Go Kartfab!!!
Ok so with the governor removed I definetly got more rpms. Towards the top of the rpm range it seems to lose power and not gain speed even though it gets loader. Is this because the valves are not closing fast enough? Floating? If i put in stronger springs woyld it let the engine build more rpms? And if so how much stronger a spring would i use over stock while not robbbing the engine of horsepower?
Ok so i ordered 18lb springs. Will install everything this weekend. Borrowed a ring compressor from my uncle.
I will probably mod this thing all the way out over the course of the next few months. Need to know where i go next. This is a street cart. Murray two seater. Its already fast for a gocart but i would willingly take it to an extreme level. Once i built tgis thing to the maximum and am confident in my abilities i will build something bigger. Probably the 13.
Mild cam, and timing advance per cam card instructions.
So i get a cam that is 8° advanced since the billet flywheel is 8°? Do i need billet valves or are the stock ones fine? And are the 18lb springs enough? Thanks.
No any cam you buy will have a dot on it line that dot up with dot on crank gear. Only thin you need look at is what timing and springs that cam requires. And what ever fits the rest of your build
So there are a plethora of cams to choose from im going to get the 380 with the valve cover spacers and it comes with the springs however it does not indicate timing requirements. Will it work with the 8° advanced timing my flywheel already has? And if the lobes do not clear the crank what are my options?
Timing, valve lash, and spring recommendations are on a cam card shipped with the cam. Aggressive cams require valve train upgrades.
Hi i have a predator 212 with header intake billet fly wheel with 32 degrees timing advance cam springs lifters restricter plate and its running on alcohol. Im sick of destroying bully clutches. The rebuild on one is 125 and new is over 350. Im looking for a old bell style clutch with atleast a 4500 rpm stall. And i cant seem to find one. Any suggestions?
You need to go and talk to a guy at a kart shop. Those bully clutches dont grenade like that unless you are using them in a way they were not intended to be used, or not maintaining them properly. Problem is not the clutch, problem is misapplication of clutch use.
With that said, take a look at the golf cart style clutches. You may need to put 3/4″ to 1″ adapter on it, but the comet 780 is good for up to 7000 rpms and can handle all the hp you can jam into the predator 212. keep in mind that if you do use a torque converter, you will lose hp through parasitic drag. The disc clutch is superior to a torque converter in this regard so you will lose out bigtime if you are putting a torque converter on an engine and racing around. also, if you look at GTC industries, they are reviving the comet 340 series torque converter, which is a smaller lighter duty version of the comet 780 built for the 3/4″ shaft engines and jr dragsters back in the day. No gurantee of its usefulness on a modified engine though so you may need to contact them as well.
Your springs are floating I looked up “hemi swap on 212cc predator motor” and a nice vid came up t hhat goes in to detail about what springs are the best for th re motor that’s where I’d look
Don’t run it high with a stock flywheel and rod!! It’ll explode and you could get injured. If you plan to run stronger springs which will, yes, allow you more rpm’s, then please upgrade to a billet flywheel and rod. They are designed to handle the higher rpm’s.
Btw, the reason it won’t go any higher is because you’re floating the valves….basically, the springs are battling so much force that they can’t close the valves which is why you get stronger springs.
Ok im completely new and wanted a hobby as well as some fun… I recently got a 212cc and havent done any mods yet to it. First off im gonna get a torque converter and upgrade air filter…. I would really like to know what exhaust system would be great for quiet… Also can anyone tell me where to get the hemi cover with the breather.. And exactly what all do i need to do to instal it
I got a new camera for my engine and I’m not sure how it’s supposed to fit in I took the old one out by taking out the rods and pushing in pins but now when I put the new one in and put it all back together it dosent get held in place by the pins and rods in other words I can just pull it out its this ok it’s a height 212 and I bought the performance kit for it for omb warehouse plz help
Cam*
Hemi 212*
Might wanna call OMB for that.
Hey KartFab, I removed the governor on my predator and now when the choke is off the engine throttles way up on its own without me touching the throttle. Any ideas?
Did you install a direct linkage and return spring? There are a lot of options, just search predator direct throttle linkage or something similiar.
I have linkage from the throttle arm to the top of the carb and the throttle arm returns to the idle position. Yet when the throttle is in idle and we turn off choke it revs up and begins driving!
throttle return spring….
I have a built 212cc predator engine what torque converter can handle the torque or power im putting down ?
Standard Comet/Chinese 30 series seems to hold up fine with modded 212s and the like.
No they don’t. Most centrifugal clutches handle the extra hp. Comet clutches have a max HP and max RPM rating on them, when you exceed that you shred belts, break sheaves, shear metal off of the drive hubs, and sometimes the drive unit flies apart.
Hey, i was wondering if these go karts (212cc engine) are faster than the 150cc Mopeds/atv/motorcycles
You cannot make that comparison, because engines are not “fast” they rotate a shaft (measured in rotations per minute) and produce torque, and how you gear a go kart with a particular engine, and transmission determines how fast the go kart will go.
I put on air filter and breather filter where do the vacuum lines from the top of the gas tank go if I add a breather filter to the crank case?
The line from the top of the tank is just for EPA purposes to recover fugitive vapors. The line has a one way check valve connected to it. You don’t have to do anything with that line. The valve cover breather can be vented to atmosphere as well. The reason people put filters on them is to keep the oil from spewing everywhere if it gets up that high on a corner. A lot of people don’t even put filters on them, instead, they run the lines to a can that collects the condensate called a catch can.
Thank you I looked everywhere for this answer
Can the muffler be removed and a custom header be installed on the CA carb/epa version?
yes
I don’t know anything about these engines but I want to learn. The predator 212 seems very popular but which one is better and what is the difference hemi and no hemi?
hemi is better, but the difference in performance isnt that big. The valve cover is different with the hemi (cast) vs non-hemi (stamped steel). Main difference is the head.
When it comes to billet rods should i purchase stock length or +.020 rod ive read the little bit larger rod is drop in also with out any other modification is this true im trying to get the best bang for the buck already purchased the billet flywheel ?
It depends. If you have to ask that question, you should do more research and measure on your own. If you get a +.020 and keep the same piston, your piston could pop up out of the block an extra .020. Depending on a ton of other factors (cam, gasket, rockers, timing) you may end up with the piston hitting something else and ruining yoru engine. Simple question, should I? Simple answer, it depends.
what does the emulsion tube do. what is a 140 do I need to change it with the jet.. when I change the jet
You dont have to but in my opinion i would upgrade it , it allows a finer more consistent stream of fuel to the carb .
Im running a 2 hole e tube with a .038 jet on my 212 predator with intake and header is there an all around better fuel setup i can be using and if not what size low end jet should i use ?
Have you read the plug? Seems like it would run rich with that size of jet. All around better fuel setup would be to get a mikuni 22 mm carb w/adapter. They have ones that bolt right onto the predator and you dont have to jack with the throttle linkage as the cable attaches directly to the top of the carb.
Kartfab just checked plug today does seem to be running rich do you think a 140 e tube and 35 36 jet is a better option also will be looking into the carb you mentioned another question at what hp should i start thinking about a torque converter do i need one ?
hey kartfab…gotta question…..my predator 212 ..custom air/exhaust…upgraded jet….i got some 26 # valve springs,are they too stiff for a stock engine?…should i go down to 18#?..i want to avoid the mod 2 cam,as i dont want it to sound like a racer engine and it makes crazy power as it is
any springs that are heavier than stock will rob horsepower until right before they float. 26 is a lot, and completely unnecessary. Just to give you some perspective, box stock racing engines only use 10.8 lb valve springs, which limit the rpm to around 6000, so anyting more than that is overkill for what you are doing. Most times, if you buy a camshaft that is a performance cam, you will get a card with that cam that tells you what you need to set your valve lash to, timing to, and what valve springs to use.
how much more hp will taking the gov out? I have a predator on a mud motor can I get away will just taking the gov out or do I have to do the fly wheel and rod??
governor taking out doesnt add hp, it just lets you rev to higher rpms.
I have a predator 212cc engine and it’s a non hemi. We put on the stage one kit without the exhaust header pipe and it went the same mph as before which is 26. Any tips? We are going to get the header pipe and muffler but do I necessarily need to remove the governor? Or should I get valve springs? Let me know what you think, thanks
governor governs rpms, when you put a stage 1 kit on it, you only increase HP, not rpms. If you remove governor, you remove the lower limit on RPM
i have a predator on a mud motor. its all stock and i average about 11 mph with just two people in my boat.. i would like to get up to 15 loaded with 2 people and gear for duck hunting. how muxh poower does just taking the governer out make? and or just doing an air filter jet and header? and then both combinded? dont wanna spend a but load of money! or i could just buy a bigger hp engine
thanks in advanced!!
so to answer both of your questions, you get the cheapest AND most hp gains from just doing high flow exhaust and intake with rejetting. You can remove governor, and put a cheap tachometer on there. The rod will break first before the flywheel. Do not put in heavier valve springs if you plan on keeping in the stock rod and flywheel.
At what rpm should I keep the engine running?
So I was about to remove my governor but then I heard that doing that can blow my engine. Is there anything I could do to make it not blow up but still be able to àgo at fast speeds with my kart
Put in billet rod and flywheel.
I started out building the standard gokart and decided midway to upgrade to live axle with disc brakes and the larger rear wheels. Do I need to also upgrade to the torque converter?
mark, a torque converter would be best. If you run a standard clutch on there, it will eventually burn up. The torque converter is way more fun too!
I have a predator on my go kart and everytime i drift the motor dies. Is it the oil sensor? Thanks
yes
Yea just unplug the yellow line going to the bolt in the front of the engine. You’ll see it
I want to know if I take a non hemisphere air box and muffler and add them to my hemisphere how does this help me when racing the stock predator class
The fuel is not flowing to my predator 212 cc engine. What do I do?
Turn the fuel lever on, and/or clean the tank, fuel line, and carburetor.
Hello my question may have been asked but I didn’t see the thread if so. I have a Predator 212 non hemi and I bought a high flow intake and filter and installed it onto the engine. I noticed very quickly that it was not running very well and I immediately knew that it was the jet so I bought a drill bit to the exact recommended size and drilled out the jet. That didn’t help at all so I moved onto buying the better built carburetor that you can change the fuel air mixture on and tried the jet I redrilled and that didn’t work so I tried the new one and then tried redrilling the new one and nothing worked. Would it be safe too assume that self drilling the jets doesn’t work properly or do you think it could be something else?
if you put a high flow intake and filter on it, you gotta put the performance exhaust on it. That is your problem. Also, you cant just go drilling holes. Try a 0.035″ jet with a gx140 emulsion tube.
My 212 cc predator engine started making a REALLY REALLY loud grinding noise when i press the gas. What is my problem?
its probably your centrifugal clutch, have you tried oiling the bushing?
As part of an introductory engineering course, we’re taking apart Predator engines. However, I’m not sure if I need a 6 inch puller or an 8 inch puller for a 6.5″ flywheel (which is what the predator seems to come with).
Is the six inch puller appropriate?
Thanks.
You just need an impact wrench to take the flywheel nut off, and then use a small pry bar and a rubber mallet. Tap the flywheel while using the prybar to put a little leverage on it. Some people break the flywheel loose by just tapping it with a hammer. I have never ever had to use a puller even on old rusty engines.
I disconnected my governor and ran my throttle direct. I did not physically remove the governor from the engine. Will the engine rimfire now that the governor is disconnected? Or do I have to totally remove it? Not sure how it would limit our RPM without being hooked to the throttle.
Mark. Bad idea. If the governor mechanism fails, it will be like a tiny grenade blew up inside the engine and all the bits of metal will cause engine failure. I am not sure what you mean by ‘rimfire’. Also, just remember that the governor is a tiny piece in the performance puzzle.
Do you have to remove governor to install mods
nope, but why would you do any mods without taking the governor out?
I am riding mine disconnected but not removed as well. Not having any problems, just tighten something down on the governer lever that connected to your throttle so it doesn’t move and clank with the gear
I just installed the stage 2 performance kit from OMB on my Predator 212cc. New pipe, race carb, 18# springs, breather, and the governor is just disconnected. It will not ripen correctly. It won’t rev up, sputters, dies, etc. Any advice?
Advice? check your valve lash. Physically remove governor. Dont rev past 5500 rpm unless you get a billet rod and flywheel. You dont even need those springs.
I had a friend mess with the screw jet on the side of the carby,and now its dies and idles rough (stock standard motor) how many turns anti clockwise from seated should it be. thanks
ummm there is no screw jet on the side of the carby for the predator 212cc. The only screw that you can adjust on those carbs is a black plastic one, and you adjust it till it idles smooth. If you have a different carb with a brass screw close to the engine side of the intake(idle mixture screw), the standard is about 2 full rotations out from seated. Hope that helps.
cheers for that.
I have a 212 cc pred. Engine was going to race it but all the clutches I’ve tried barley move the kart any suggestions these clutches I bought used from a kart shop not sure if it takes too many rpms too turn them or if it’s the engine itself but up on stands it turns the back wheels fine but takes half throttle to turn em
if you got a disc race clutch, they typically engage at the rpms that the predator with governor is limited to (e.g limited to 3600 rpm and clutch engages at 4100 rpm). Might want to call the place you got your clutch from. Honestly, i think it could be either that or your gearing. With smallish tires (15″ or lower) you are usually ok with a 6:1 gear ratio e.g. axle teeth divided by clutch teeth.
I just bought a go kart it has a predator 212 on it. The chain snapped on me there is a chain going from the clutch to a shaft that then has a sprocket that goes to the sprocket on the rear axle. The chain from the clutch to the first sprocket is a 40 the chain from the second sprocket to the rear axle is a 41. Will that cause problems with the chain snapping. Would a torque converter help and what does it do exactly? And I think I can weld a plate on the frame to offset the engine to run one chain from the clutch to the rear axle. I have a lot of questions please help.
join the forum at diygokarts.com and ask these questions there.
I have a 6.5 predator motor on my mini bike i took out govenor and the plastic gears shredded inside the motor and it started dying out n not going so i bought a new motor and took out all parts to the governor completly out then after driving it full out it started dyeing out at top speed on this one too then i read up n said i needed 18# springs to keep it from floating so i did that but its now throwing white smoke from the tail pipe n still at top speed cutting out on me n then dyes completely what do i do or whats am i not doing?? Please!!
Sounds like you are pretty good at ruining your engines. My suggestion would be to call up a go kart race shop and ask them. There are too many variables to mention that could be the cause, and from the sounds of it, you may not even know what to do to get your engine running correctly.
Please suggest a correct gear ratio. I searched on the net and forums and found out that 5:1 gives more top speed but less acceleration than 6:1 but is not capable of carrying weight around 350lbs. so should I opt 6:1? I am using the comet TAV 30 series with 10T driven clutch sprocket and (thinking of)60T sprocket on rear axle with 11″ slick tires. My purpose is a racing gokart not off-roading. The engine is B&S 208cc 9lb.ft@3060rpm with 3/4″ shaft.
Hitesh, 5:1 and 6:1 are both great ratios for 11″ tires and the 30 series torque converter. If you are racing a go kart, then why do you have a torque converter on it? Race karts use disc style centrifugal clutches.
I have a baja 200cc motor on my go kart can i put predator 212 performance parts on it.
Intake, exhaust, carb, yes. Internals like connecting rod and flywheel, no.
I just bought a predator 212 and I’m about to rejet with a 140/36 combo, I’ve also added a high flow exhaust and intake. My question is my sproket and clutch are from a funkart 5hp do I need to replace these with better ones?
And should I use full synthetic oil and premium fuel?
premium fuel isnt necessary unless you change your compression ratio (which you have not) any regular pump gas will work, and the higher octane stuff will not make any difference. Synthetic oil will give you a tiny, negligible boost in performance. Clutch, you could do a racing style clutch (disc) or a heavy duty one.
No the clutch and sprocket are good they aren’t like engine parts they will work on any type of motor
I rebuilt my pred 212 the other day and was riding around and there seems to be a slight loss of power and torque. Also when deaccelerating it seems like it is not engine braking and sounds a bit weird when deaccelerating . My valve lash is set currently to .003, thinking it might be something with valve timing?
did you get a massive exhaust? One common mistake is to get a large exhaust, which slows exhaust flow and kills torque.
I did get a new exhaust but its not massive its the same as the old one
hmm, I dunno. Depends on what you rebuilt.
where can i bay a engien 121cc
buy sorry ths
I just but a charging coil on my predator engine 212 cc and it wont start. Any help
They don’t make charging coils for the predator engine.
This is the picture of the gocar well it looks like it but my back tires are bigger than the picture lol
Today I was riding maybe about 3k rpm or so and I heard a pretty loud bang I wasn’t sure quite what it was so I rode maybe 30 more feet and it did it again so I shut the engine off and stopped. I looked for any visible damage and did not see and. I tried to pull the starter but I couldn’t pull the cord out at all. I drained the oil and took the crank cover off and from what i could see everything was ok. Is it the piston that is seized or what? I can move the piston down with some force, but when it hits the apex and comes back up it only goes up maybe a cm.
Garrett, what you are describing sounds major. There are several possibilities as to what it could be, but you can’t really know until you tear it down. For $120.00, you can buy a 6.5 h.p. Predator from Harbor Freight. It is a Chinese clone of a Honda engine. You won’t be able to fix yours for that, and you can be up and running quickly. Then if you want you can look into the other one when you have the time. This is a shot in the dark, because I don’t know your situation. It’s just what I would do. You may want to take the time to tear it down, and do the research, and buy the parts, and have any necessary machine work done. Anyway best of luck to you.
This happened to a friend of mine on his Predator 212 mini bike. I removed the Flywheel housing and there was a nail nudged between the Flywheel Magnet and the block. I removed the nail and it spun and started right up. Hope this helps you my friend.
If i want to put a 27mm carb on my 212 predator what type of manifold should i get ?
I have a Baja Warrior mini bike with a Predator 212. I have read yours and others about performance modification and decided to just modify the air, exhaust, and carb (e-tube 140 and 36 jet). I do not feel I want to disconnect the governor, I just want some more power and torque. As stock I get 22-25mph and with the above modification would expect/hope to get near 30mph. What do you think? Do you think I would notice an improvement with just this modification?
The governor limits your top speed, you will just accelerate faster(more torque), but not go any faster. If you remove governor with those mods, then you can get to that 30 mph range.
I would like to increase rpm from ~3600 (stock limit) to about 4300 to 4500 without removing governor. Can I change spring tension on linkage to achieve that? Also there are two springs in the throttle assembly. Can you explain what each does?
Thanks
This isn’t possible. The linkage tension only affect the throttle manifold in the carb. The governor literally will limit the Rpms to the stock setting as long as it’s inside. No matter what mods you put on.
More mods won’t get you any more speed unless you remove the governor. Unless you change the sprocket sizes. More mods will just make more power (low end) and acceleration.
Hey why are you only going like 35 mph I have the same thing a Baja warrior with a 212 predator connected to a centrifugal clutch and im going like 55, 60 mph
I think you are exaggerating. Do you have a GPS speed app or video of you going that fast?
I have a predator 212 with the modified intake. We are at 4000 foot elevation what do you advise for jet size and emulsion tube? I plan on doing the exhaust as well.
Thanks
Jetting only starts to matter a bunch above 6000 feet. The higher you go, the less fuel you need as the air density basically allows less oxygen in with the same volume of intake, so you will run rich at high altitude with the same size jet at sea level, so you gotta go with a smaller jet than expected. maybe .032 to .036 range? It really should be based on the power you are making at your target rpm range. You can look up ‘how to read a spark plug’ and get a good idea for it as well as just listening to the engine. If it smokes/bogs down on acceleration, you are probably rich (kind of like you are running it on choke), lean condition can also cause it to bog, but it wont have power and will get hot fast. Id just go with a.036 and see how it feels, you may have to go smaller though based on what you find out with how the engine runs.
Hey buddy do u know anything about cams for the 212cc predator, also i have a torque converter on mine and it runs great I plan to make a mudding cart out of it I wanna take out my governer disconnect my oil sencer putting as high flow air filter and adding a2-3ft pvc pipe so my filter don’t get muddy , putting a performance exhaust also I’m putting a charging coil with the magnetic fly wheel so I can have lights without having to charge a battery I have 28″ atv wheels on it she’ll burn em as it sits but more power is always better haha what cam do u think I should go with and is there anything special I can do to give it more torque ?
Hello I disassembled my new hemi motor .put the mod 2 cam in it. 26 LB springs ARC flywheel thin metal head gasket remove the governor. And that oil sensor. Pipe and air cleaner. rejected the carb . Now when I try to start it . won’t start feels like it has no compression. It has great spark and is getting fuel but it’s like it’s on the wrong stroke! how do I get it back to top dead center . On the compression stroke? I lined up the dogs on the crank and cam. But I think the valves are backwards. How do I fix this ? please help thank you
I lined up the dots . Not the dogs lol
I figured it out. It was the metal head gasket I put in it ! must’ve not sealed. Put the stock head gasket back in and it had plenty of compression. I found top dead center and it seems to run good.
The thinner head gasket put clearance in the valve train equal to the difference between the two head gaskets. I put a .0010 steel gasket on my Predator 212 in place of the stock .0040 . The engine would not build enough compression until I turned the rocker arm nuts about 1 1/4 turns in. The engine started on the first pull after that.
Daytona, you need to torque head bolts to factory specs and set valve lash to spec for intake and exhaust with a feeler gauge so you get the best performance.
I have a 212cc engine and I think I lost power to my engine once I added a intake my go cart wants to turn off for some reason so I have to accelerate it so it won’t turn off on me
exhaust? Jet size? governor removed or no?
Ok I Have put on a new air filter with the jet that came with it and a new header pipe. I have taken out the Governor on my Predator 212cc engine. My go kart is now really fast and that is what I was going for. It ran great for couple of days I went to start it last night and can not get it started sounds like it is getting spark but will not turn over. Any ideas?
Hmmm is your carb clean? pour a teaspoon of gas in the spark plug hole and see if it starts with throttle wide open. When you remove governor, you gotta make sure that the throttle is manually held open when starting it so it will let air in.
I have tryed everything and still will not start. I guess I will take the side plate off and see if everything is ok inside now I wish I had not ever messed with it. maybe my timeing is off I just do not know. I did not drive it hard be fore it quit.
Held throttle wide open when I pull start and after a couple pulls it started!!!
Well it starts and idles good but when I give it gas it dies??
Adjust idle screw (black plastic one on top) to idle as fast as possible without engaging your clutch. Give it gas only after warming up (run engine a few minutes). make sure intake gaskets are sealing after carb, and that carb has been cleaned.
Finally got the engine started again ran it about a mile and a half engine shut off when I came to a stop. I cant get it started again I am worn out.
How much does it increase the engine’s power if I did all of these mods
a lot. It will increase horsepower and max rpm so you go faster, and have a little more hp. so 7 hp might go up to 8-10, and max speed from lets say 25 might go up to 35 or 40, just depends on what you do and what your gearing is.
Hey, I have removed the governor, blueprinted carb. Jetted to #36 high flow exhaust. I get gas vapor out the carb at full throttle. Any idea what that is caused by?
Hmmm. probably has something to do with timing, valves, flow inertia. If your timing is too far advanced it will cause the air to ‘bounce’ back off of the valve. Valve could not be closing all the way (check valve lash), and with the inertia, your carb doesnt care which way air flows, it just flows from high pressure to low pressure so you might have the wrong size carb opening, wrong size muffler, or a number of things. A blueprinted carb could have an opening that is optimal for lets say 7500 rpm, but you only run it at 400 rpm and you could get that symptom as well. Good luck because I really cant help other than saying that it is a complicated problem :/
Thanks for your help, what is the recommended valve lash? 18lb springs. No governor. Everything else is stock
I havea prediter engine an im turning it. 4550 an trying yo get more we out up it but im racing stock any advice on how
intake, exhaust, jets. That outta let you rev really high. You run the risk of blowing a connecting rod though if you rev too high.
I have a cl1308 cam it said on card to set timing to 32/34 degrees. It also gave us 2 sets of valve springs. Are we supposed to run them together? How much would it hurt to leave timing stock and pros and cons on the springs if any info? Thank you!!
Some valve springs are dual rate (looks like two sets, but has an inside portion and an outside portion that fit together). If you are just building this engine, you want to take out the inner portion of the spring set for the break in period, then put the inner portion of the spring in after break in is complete. Valve springs are highly dependent on your target RPM and cam, so they are probably the right ones. For break in you want to buy oil specific to break in (aka BREAK IN OIL) brand doesn’t matter as long as it has ZDDP in it to protect the lifters and cam from wearing down before they mate together. To answer your question about leaving timing stock, I would say this: if you want to leave timing stock, do not even put the cam or springs in there. Timing, cam, valve lash settings, and springs ALL work together. If you disregard any of these settings, then your engines performance will suffer.
Changed the jet to a 9mm now my predator 212cc runs sluggish. What should I do?
I mean #36, sorry.
Did you replace intake and exhaust with high flow?
I have a Pred 212 with no gov, free flow header and uni air intake(filter). I’m Thinking I need a new clutch, as I am going above about 3.6k rpm at times. I’m not sure on what one to get. What do you recommend?
any racing clutch will work, noram cheetah, bully etc as long as it is a ‘racing’ clutch it will rev as high as you want it. Will cost $100-$350 depending on quality of clutch but they will all work.
Need help, I’ve drilled holes on the stock airfilter box, changed the exhaust to a 1 inch pipe. After those mods my predator 212cc takes a while for it to start.
the governor was removed? Governor holds the throttle open so if you remove it, you gotta put on choke and manually hold governor open and it should start right up. If its already warm, you start with no choke.
When installing the new air filter what about the 2 breather tubes? Should I just cap them?
the breather tube out of the halve cover should just vent to atmosphere. The tube from the tank can be capped, but its not necessary as it actually has a check valve in it.
I have read just about every comment on this thread. Highly educational. Glad to know the answers to all these common issues. Great Kart rebuild site!!
I just upgraded the intake, exhaust, and carb jet. I’m quickly reaching the motors peak because of these recent upgrades. What should be my next upgrade? Removing the governor, obviously. But after that it seems I would need to upgrade the other components on the motor. What would those be?
i have not made this yet but i am gonna build it now because the engine is on sale for 99.99 on harborfreight.com but if i buy the engine the kit and the steel is that everythig i need
Yeah, steel, hardware(nuts/bolts), engine are the only things you need to get separate from the kit.
If I just do intake and exhaust do have to rejet it or what would happen if I don’t
It will run lean, overheat your engine, and have poor performance at best. At worst, you can seize your engine. Let me ask you a question: why bother with an intake and exhaust if you aren’t going to jet it correctly? Might as well keep it stock if you do that.
How do I get 15hp out of my predator engine
upgrade everything in it.
Hi again, normally for the stock 6.5 hp engine I would need a 30 series torque converter, but if I add all of these performance parts will I need a bigger torque converter since it increases the hp?
Could it be fine with a 30 series or should I get the bigger one for precaution?
question I’m running the 212 predator motor with a header mod drilled out intake runs fine just having hard trouble starting really hard to pull then jerks back at some points what could be the problem
Valve lash set too wide (doesn’t open compression release) or a sheared flywheel key (timing messed up). Did you ever mess with the head, flywheel, or put in a cam without a compression release?
Y does my predator 212cc engine die when I hit a bump or jump.
low oil sensor is still connected. Disconnect yellow wire and you are good.
I bought a upgrade kit to install on my predator 212cc motor. I’m not sure how to install most of parts. My biggest question is how i install the walbro fuel pump. Do i just use the hole in the OHV cover to the vacuum side of the pump or what?
If you plan on keeping the stock gas tank on the engine, there is no need for a pulse pump like that. The only reason you need that is if you install a remote gas tank below the height of the carb. The valve cover does need what is called a ‘pulse fitting’. The hole that is already in the cover is to vent to a catch can with performance intake already there. There are plenty of places to find out where and how to install a pulse fitting based on your valve cover (hemi/non-hemi) so you just need to do a little searching on google.
I’m just upgrading intake and exhaust. Is it even necessary to remove governor?
Nope.
Thanks for the input kartfab!
i plan on doing the intake, re-jet & exhaust and maybee hi-comp head….this is just a predator powered fun kart…question is, at what point is a better centrifugal clutch needed & what do you recommend???
If you are going above 3600 RPM, you should get any ‘racing’ clutch. They are pretty expensive though, so a good alternative would be a copy of a racing clutch that you could get here http://www.gopowersports.com/3-4-bore-clutch-heavy-duty/#_a_KartFab it has 40/41 pitch chain with a 3/4″ bore.
awesome thank you for your help
I have several ?s i am running a box stock predator class we are allowed to remove the gas tank an replace with a topplate an fuelpump we are allowed to remove the govenor and low senser switch We have to run the factory air box and factory exhaust the engines are goin to be sealed so my ? i know i cant change the valve springs because they will tech those what can i do to just be at the limit of passin tech an get all the hp i cn get outta it any ideals or theorys eould be greatly appreciated
i need to do this to the engine before i take it an have the track seal it but it has to be things undetectable lol
LOL!!! Whell I would say, follow the rules or risk getting banned. Can you run a cam? Can you mill the head? can you deck the block? can you index the spark plug? Can you install a longer plug for higher compression? Can you run light oil? Can you bore out the cylinder for a slightly larger displacement and slightly larger piston? Can you get a slightly longer rod for increased compression? Can you advance timing for your target rpm? Can you get a billet flywheel? Can you jet for your target RPM? Can you get a bored out carburetor? Can you port and polish? CAn you install different ratio rockers? Can you install roller rockers? can you get higher nose pressure springs that are still legal? Can you install a gx160 head for higher compression? Can you taper the exhaust pipe to mate perfectly with the exhaust port? can you polish the exhaust tubing interior for optimal flow? Can you get chrome-moly push rods? Can you install file to fit rings sized to your target max RPM?
Other basic stuff that is LEGAL would be to properly break in your engine, lap your valves, and ensure proper valve lash.
Also, tires and optimal GEARING are going to get you far, and probably make the biggest difference besides the engine. Crap tires or incorrect gearing can ruin you in a race. If the rules allow it, get a disc clutch (e.g. cheetah, bully) instead of a centrifugal clutch, and set engagement at peak HP rpms. Make sure your alignment is good, and is done perfectly for the track you will be racing on (e.g. oval vs other. Bearings should be in excellent shape too.
I have a predator motor and everything on it is stock. I took the governor out and the oil sensor. It also has the performance exhaust header on it already. I want to take the gas tank off the top of the motor and put the top plate with the fuel filter on top of the motor. One line on the filter runs to the tank, the other one goes to the carb, but I think the other one is supposed to go to the OHV cover. Do I have to tap a hole and put a spout on there to run the line? Also I want to know how much hp it will have after I replace the stock flywheel, use longer rods and all that other performance stuff.
Colton, you don’t need to put a pump on the motor with the gas tank setup that way. The choice is up to you though, and yes you would need to run the fuel pump off the crankcase pressure. If it were me, I’d just leave the tank on it and get the performance intake and re-jet the carb. You can expect about 8-10 hp (vs 6.5 hp stock) with those upgrades. Do not get a longer connecting rod, just get stock unless you plan on getting a performance piston that calls for a different length billet rod.
Hi kartfab would like some input i am busy with a kart and got a Honda G150 engine will it be good for a kart or not
Sure, as long as it has a horizontal straight shaft it should be fine. It wont have a lot of power, but it would be ok for a small go kart.
I have removed the governor. And the oil sensor on my motor. What do I do with the on off switch? Will it run with it disconnected?
the yellow wire (assuming you have a honda clone or predator) that goes from he low oil switch that comes out of the block has a bullet connector to another yellow wire. All you have to do is unplug the yellow wires and it will prevent the engine from dying around corners. The kill switch will still function this way.
I’m a little nervous as to remove the governor, I’ve had past adults in my life telling me that removing it is a bad idea, are there any precautions I should take? What risks do I run (besides blowing up my engine)
Also, if I’m removing it from a predator, which already has a seperate throttle system, would I need to do anything to ensure that the throttle would still work
yeah man, removing the governor is a big deal. If you over rev you could break the connecting rod or shatter the flywheel. Connecting rod is more likely to go, and it would punch a hole in the block if it went. If you stay under 5000 rpms, this probably wont happen, and valve float will probably occur before you reach rpms that could break the connecting rod or flywheel (happens around 6000+ RPM, but is not a figure to say anything less than 6k is good, which it is NOT). Don’t put in heavy springs unless you get a billet connecting rod and billet flywheel, then the motor will be good for a much higher RPM.
If I install a Billet wheel and rod, .275 camshaft, and 26 lbs valve springs, will this be enough to safely do 10,000 RPM?
No you don’t even hit 10000 rpm
To do 10k you will probably need a stroker kit from arc. a Big mikuni carb. Roller rockers and a high lift cam. You will also need some cnc ported ports in your head. It might make it.
I have the predator hemi with 26lb springs f275 cam ss valves 1 to 2 rockers head milled 050 will this set up be ok for valve to piston clearance please help dont wont to blow it up. Thanks
Check your cam card. A cam with a high lift accomplishes the same thing as rockers – they both lift the valves HIGHER, allowing air and exhaust to flow more freely through the head. This is further complicated with TIMING, and clearance with the head being milled… Here is what CAN go wrong 1) higher valve lift may cause springs to bind – you don’t necessarily need super heavy springs, just springs that are good enough for your target RPM, springs rob hp, but let you rev higher. Check spring specs vs total lift height of valve. You may need to do some additional work with creating a pocket and installing a retainer so the springs don’t bottom out. 2) higher valve lift in conjunction with a longer duration cam, and advanced timing may cause valves to contact piston (unlikely) but it needs to be checked. You need to figure out DURATION of the cam to make sure the valves are closing in time. You can do another check by putting play dough in the head, and rotating everything. The valves will leave an imprint on the play-dough and you can see if it is thick enough. You will need to call a reputable race shop and ask them, or do some serious investigation looking at tables to make sure everything works out alright. Please, make sure you put on a billet flywheel and billet connecting rod. Because you have heavy springs in there, you don’t want the engine to over rev and grenade the connecting rod and or flywheel.
At full throttle my engine bugs out. What can I do to fix it?
clean your carb.
I’m sitting here reading the comments and thinking about porting and polishing, cam, larger jet in the carb, new flywheel, and connecting rod hooking up a tachometer, and oil temp gauge. With the cam I would need the stiffer springs, and while it’s apart, might as well lose the governor. Then the man said, if you are going to do that much, you might as well go with a two cycle that was designed for that. I thought we were staying with a common theme here. Home built Go Cart with a Predator engine. That combination is really cool because it allows just about everyone to get a Go Cart. Not just any Go Cart, but one that is a good cart , with a new engine. The fact that you put it together yourself is just icing on the cake. The design of this cart, I think is excellent, so it’s going to be that and the Predator.
I have upgraded my predictor motor with the header pipe,intake,carb. When I start it it smells like something is burning . Any clues what it could be
well, engines burn gas to run, so that might be it 🙂 What about jetting, did you rejet? After you run your engine for a little bit, check the spark plug. Is it wet? Dry? Black? White? Brown? Any colored smoke coming out of the exhaust after it warms up and you have the choke off?
Ok so I upgraded my 212cc predator and put an air filter adapter with air filter . Where do the lines from the top of the gas tank and the other line from the valve cover go? I’m trying to find out what to do with both of them. Plz help. (And it’s also a he might if that has anything to do with it)
the line from the gas tank is just a vent that the EPA requires. It has a one way check valve in it, so you don’t have to do anything with the line from the tank, just don’t plug it. The line from the valve cover is also one of those emission reducing lines so it originally vented back to the airbox. Well, you dont really need that to vent to the airbox, so it can vent to atmosphere. Some people attach a hose clamp and small air filter or fuel filter on the vent to keep dirt from getting in the vent. Some people just rotate it and let it vent downward.
I have a non hemi predator 212 with a wind pma on it that runs 24 hrs. I have carb problems as the engine doesn’t run very smooth. Any recommendations to what I can do to this for fuel economy and smoothness and longevity.
hmmm, i would say best practices would be to remove the air filter and pre filter and get a new one, wash the pre filter and make sure you change oil and air filter according to run time in the operation manual. The carb would need to be cleaned. If you want the engine to run best in the long term, you don’t want to remove the governor, just keep it all stock and maintain it according to the users manual. Syntheitic 10w30 oil would probably be the best in above freezing temps, and 5w30 in below freezing.
I’ve been trying to find a manual transmission for this engine I’d be nice if it had a manual clutch too any help?
Sorry. Nothing I can think of. You might want to look into peerless race built transmissions. Those are the only ones I have seen.
Thank you I know you can get manual transmissions on minibike but I can’t just find the engine and transmission
Hi,
Great thread! I’ve read that if you remove the governor that the flywheel should be replaced with a billet one. Apparently, at higher rpm the stock flywheel can shatter. I’ve never seen this personally. Do you agree? I’m not racing my kart. It’s just for fun but I want it to be safe.
Mike, you should buy a tachometer and make sure that you never exceed 5500 RPMS with the stock flywheel. Once you start exceeding 6000 rpms you will need to get a billet connecting rod and a billet flywheel. The thing that prevents exceeding 6K rpms is what is called ‘valve float’ – valves stop seating because the valve springs can’t fully close them before the next cycle. This acts as a secondary governor to keep the engine from failing. You can get a cheap tachometer from ebay and monitor your RPM’s to be safe. As a disclaimer, you are doing this at your own risk and the liability is completely yours for any engine modification other than stock. Whatever you do, NEVER replace the valve springs without replacing the connecting stock rod and stock flywheel with billet aluminum ones at the same time.
If you have the high flow header, the high flow intake, and re-jetted carb, what kind or power should you expect? Is 8-10 HP and 10-12 ft-lbs a reasonable assumption?
It depends on elevation, and RPM’s for the exact HP and Torque. You get your most bang for the buck by doing those mods.
What mod can I do and still let it apear stock
If you want it to be stock appearing, you don’t mod it 🙂 Stock appearing usually refers to springs, which are usually meant to look stock, but may be illegal to race with, unless your particular set of rules allow ‘stock appearing’ mods.
Can you tell me how to plumb a catch can on predator 212 with a after market air filter
You take the hose from the valve cover, and you run the line from it to the catch can.
After the governor is removed on the predator 212. Is it necessary to remove the oil sensor?
I am also wondering if when changing the jets, does the e tube need to be changed as well? Thanks.
It is best to change out the emulsion tube when changing out the jet, but not required. The emulsion tube change just allows for a stronger fuel signal in the carb.
I did I bought it as a set
The oil sensor removal is not required. Most people just disconnect the yellow wire coming out of the low oil shutoff. It has a simple bullet connector that you just separate.